New Inspector - love/hate

[eronel]

I love that the inspector does not take up so much screen real estate now.

I hate that everything is split up into separate modes, even things that are in common. This means that when I arrow up and down the project hierarchy I can no longer view the inspector info for each item without mousing over to the inspector and changing the mode. Sorry, Omni, but this is a really bad thing. Please tell me there are plans to change this.

[type11]

Hate.

I agree, splitting the inspector into separate modes makes for a really poor UI experience.

[filmgeek]

It's a problem because now you have to do tons of clicks to switch to different panels.

[SpiralOcean]

Agreed. Maybe they have plans to allow a person to drag on of the groups off to make their own window?

[eronel]

Agreed. Maybe they have plans to allow a person to drag on of the groups off to make their own window?

That would solve the new problem created by the modal inspector, but it wouuld negate the gains in screen real estate and consolidation that I think were the goal of the new format. For me, I'd rather not have a bunch of little inspectors all over that I have to dismiss.

[coconino]

Hate. It adds clicks, adds mental processing overhead in remembering what the icons mean, and doesn't allow easy quick assessment of items when arrow-keying through the list. I understand that more features means gizmos need to be squeezed onto each inspector, but the current layout is a backward step IMHO.

Also, it seems broken when inspecting projects.

[joelande]

Couldn't they just make it so that when you click on an action, the action inspector is shown, when you click on a project, the project inspector is shown, ditto for group and context?

Auto-switching the inspector based on selection would eliminate all of the clicking....

[eronel]

As long as the position of common items is retained for the different views. If I'm arrowing around my list and looking at repeats, for example, I want to anchor my eyes in the same place and see all repeat info there, whether it's project, action group, or task repeats.

[iNik]

There's some more discussion about this in this thread. (http://forums.omnigroup.com/showthread.php?t=6116&highlight=inspector)

I think having the inspectors (optionally?) switch dynamically depending on what you select might be ideal. You can always click on the Project inspector tab/mode while a task is selected if you want to change the containing project, but otherwise you'll get everything you need to edit that task as soon as its selected.

The movement of the inspector might be a bit jarring, but I think it could be made to work well.

I'm NOT a fan of splitting up property types (repeats, etc.) as with the old inspectors. I think there's great value to having the ability to edit every property of an item in one place. (Even if it DOES have a disturbing similarity to many Windows apps' "properties" panes)

[SpiralOcean]

The inspectors didn't take up that much more room than what we have. You could always collapse the ones you didn't want to see and you would have the same real estate you have now. Only now, for those that have the real estate to see all inspectors at once... can not see all inspectors at once.

[joelande]

The inspectors didn't take up that much more room than what we have.
Yes they did.

Three times as long with everything open.

[QUOTE=SpiralOcean;28336You could always collapse the ones you didn't want to see and you would have the same real estate you have now. [/QUOTE]
And now you are back to multiple clicks and mousing around

[SpiralOcean]

Yes they did.

Three times as long with everything open.


And now you are back to multiple clicks and mousing around

My point was...
some of us wanted all of them open. Yes that is more real estate.

If you closed all but one... how it is now... the real estate is pretty much the same.

If you are speaking of having to close one and open another...
maybe a better enhancement idea would be to have an option+click.

option+click on an inspector, and all would close except the one you click on.

[coconino]

I'm back to 95827 for the time being. Plus there's a nasty crash in 95919 which seems to be invoked by deleting items.

[jasong]

This "new" inspector is a hallmark of Omni applications. It works great in OmniOutliner, where you generally set-it-and-forget-it™, but not as well when you're constantly in the inspector, making changes or looking up information.

This may be a sign that the inspector is not the best method of interacting with actions and projects, and yet another sign that treating actions, groups and projects so very differently has its drawbacks.

[AmberV]

Ick! Ick! No! Extreme dislike! If they are going to be this way, at least make it like OmniGraffle where you can shift-click to view more than one panel at once. Hopefully that is the ultimate intention here, as they do kind of look that same, and they just haven't hooked up that code yet.

What is the point in having forced exclusion tabs? It makes no sense.

[richardripley]

I don't like the new Inspector. It is really hard to use and too modal. Click here, click there - yikes - here comes carpel tunnel.

Please fix this!

[ptone]

I'd would prefer the new one if it were dynamic, but the old one otherwise.

I think once you allocate horizontal space on most 16:9 screens, you might as well have it full height.

To collapse the current inspector to its title bar is dumb, just show/hide it with toolbar or keyboard.

I still think that most of the inspector should be moved to a context sensitive toolbar ala iWork 08 (while keeping the full set of stuff in some form of inspector ala iWork 08).

-P

[pvonk]

Don't like the new, let's have the old!

[bigcloits]

I'm loving my first few days with OF, but I have to agree with the mood in this thread: the new inspectors immediately frustrated me for all of the above reasons.

[Andrew]

As Tim notes in the Feature request: Dynamic inspectors (http://forums.omnigroup.com/showthread.php?t=6116) thread, auto-switching of inspectors is coming, just not implemented yet.

I think that will make a big difference to how well the new inspector scheme works, so if people will re-evaluate it when that happens, hopefully we'll only need minor tweaks/polishing to this scheme.

[Tim Wood]

95983 has a first pass of this. There are still other bugs with the inspectors, but this would minimize the number of times you need to manually pick an inspector.

[gamov]

I also hate the new inspectors.
If it is context sensitive it would be better but I don't want to have to click to see info
I should be able to cascade them to have all the relevant ones open. An option, compact or full view...

[curt.clifton]

Welcome to beta testing folks. You need to wait for features to be fully implemented before passing judgment. If you aren't willing to deal with quirks like partially implemented inspectors, then you need to wait for the release version in early '08.

[eronel]

Since I started this thread, I'd like to respond to Curt's objections. The release notes of Nov. 11 did not address dynamic switching, which was my objection. It had only indicated there were "rough edges (icons, selection on startup) that we are still addressing."

In another thread, Omni had said
I'm not sure if inspectors will always automatically switch based on the selection ...

I believe beta testing is the appropriate time to indicate disappointment with the way a new feature is implemented.

Perhaps I was remiss not to have continued the dynamic filters thread that iNik started. I did not intentionally mean to split the discussion; I was simply in a hurry.

[jasong]

Welcome to beta testing folks. You need to wait for features to be fully implemented before passing judgment. If you aren't willing to deal with quirks like partially implemented inspectors, then you need to wait for the release version in early '08.

Sorry, but the point of beta testing is precisely to make our feelings on a feature known with enough time for Omni to reconsider the decision. If not now, when?

[AmberV]

I just started working with the new dynamic inspectors. We'll see how it goes. Definitely an improvement from the way it was, though I would still like the ability to show all of them by shift-clicking as in OmniGraffle 4.

It should be also mentioned that I do quite like the new arrangements of content in the panes themselves.

[curt.clifton]

I'm sorry, I didn't express my thoughts completely and ended up sounding like a jerk. That wasn't my intent.

Having lived with OF since May, I know that features are introduced in a rough state, then polished (quickly). I think it's important to reserve judgment until they Omnicians have applied their magic. So, yes, giving feedback on what you like and don't like is vitally important, and Omni will respond. But "loving" or "hating" a feature based on its initial incarnation seems an overly strong choice of language.