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-   -   OmniGraffle for iPad is $49.95? (http://forums.omnigroup.com/showthread.php?t=15804)

BwanaZulia 2010-03-29 02:18 AM

OmniGraffle for iPad is $49.95?
 
That is rough. I mean, I love OmniGraffle and all (own the pro version) but $50 for the iPad version seems a little high.

Oh and PLEASE make the OmniFocus version universal I don't have to re-buy.

BZ

Púca 2010-03-29 07:23 AM

I agree about OmniGraffle. $49.99 is way too high a price when Apple will ship Pages for $9.99, Numbers for $9.99, and Keynote for $9.99.

And it looks like Bento will be $4.99.

I think you have to reconsider here, Omnifolk. :-)

dannythefool 2010-03-30 05:16 AM

Hmm. If it is less than half as good as the $99 standard mac version, why would you even buy it? But if it is half as good, why not pay half the price? :)

amorya 2010-03-30 05:57 AM

[QUOTE=Púca;75179]I agree about OmniGraffle. $49.99 is way too high a price when Apple will ship Pages for $9.99, Numbers for $9.99, and Keynote for $9.99.

And it looks like Bento will be $4.99.

I think you have to reconsider here, Omnifolk. :-)[/QUOTE]

Betcha they wouldn't get ten times the sales if they reduced it to $5.

Amorya

Púca 2010-03-30 08:03 AM

[QUOTE=dannythefool;75215]Hmm. If it is less than half as good as the $99 standard mac version, why would you even buy it? But if it is half as good, why not pay half the price? :)[/QUOTE]
Why? A whole bunch of reasons.
[LIST=1][*]If you're old enough to have bought vinyl albums, and 8-tracks, and cassettes, and CD's, and now MP3's, you get tired of paying list price for the same thing over and over again.[*]An iPad is *not* your primary computer. It's an accessory. It's handy, but you can only do so much on it. It's designed in such a way that you need to sync it to a primary computer (on which you've already paid for OmniGraffle).[*]While Version 1.0 certainly costs OmniGroup a fair amount of time & money investment, future versions of all their apps will clearly be designed with phones, iPads, and Macs in mind. The code base will surely have more shared code. I'm not saying it will be trivial, but certainly the cost of producing the next version of OmniGraffle for Mac/phone/iPad will be much less than version 1.0 because they will be designing for all 3 at once.[/LIST]
Sure, I don't think OmniGraffle for iPad should be free. That's crazy! They have to make some money on it, of course.

But as long as iPads are accessories to your main computer, you need to price the software as an accessory to the main product.

I can't speak for others, but as far as I'm concerned, if it's significantly more expensive than Pages, Keynote, Numbers (or Bento), then I won't buy it.

Púca 2010-03-30 08:15 AM

[QUOTE=amorya;75217]Betcha they wouldn't get ten times the sales if they reduced it to $5.[/QUOTE]
I think they would.

But I'm not saying $5 is the sweet spot for OmniGroup. I'm sure it's higher than that. $9.99 is certainly the minimum they should consider charging, but again I'd guess they'd make more money at $14.99 or $19.99.

But $49.99?

I really doubt it would do well at that price point.

BwanaZulia 2010-03-30 09:20 AM

I agree that Apple is setting the standard for prices at $9.99, but OmniFocus for the iPhone is $19.99.

That being said, I think that iPhone + iPad versions should be under $20. $50? I can buy 10 apps on MacUpdate for $50.

OmniGroup, reconsider please.

BZ

Ken Case 2010-03-30 10:02 AM

Might I suggest reserving judgment until we actually announce a price? At that point we'll also announce what the product is and can do—which is the context you'll need, if you want to judge whether it's worth its price for you.

whpalmer4 2010-03-30 10:23 AM

[QUOTE=Púca;75221]Why? A whole bunch of reasons.[*]If you're old enough to have bought vinyl albums, and 8-tracks, and cassettes, and CD's, and now MP3's, you get tired of paying list price for the same thing over and over again.
[/quote]
So don't buy it again. If it isn't worth the purchase price to you, don't buy it.

I'm pretty sure this version of OmniGraffle isn't the same thing. I just fired up OmniGraffle on my Mac, tried using my fingers on the screen to manipulate a drawing, and nothing happened. I suspect a different result will be had with the iPad version!
[quote][*]An iPad is *not* your primary computer. It's an accessory. It's handy, but you can only do so much on it. It's designed in such a way that you need to sync it to a primary computer (on which you've already paid for OmniGraffle).
[/quote]
Doesn't matter if the iPad is my primary computer or not. If I can run OmniGraffle on it, I may not need a copy of OmniGraffle on any other device. A $50 price point starts looking very attractive! $50 is expensive compared to typical App Store pricing, to be sure, but someone who hasn't had sufficient justification to shell out $100 or more for a copy of OmniGraffle for the Mac now has a much cheaper alternative. If it is a well-done iPad app, they may pick up a lot of new customers, and existing customers who become iPad fans will probably pick up a copy as well if word gets out that it is an enjoyable experience to use it. This same argument applies to OmniFocus, OmniPlan, OmniOutliner -- if the iPad app is done well, it may be a perfectly reasonable standalone application even though the iPad itself currently requires you to have another computer.

[quote][*]While Version 1.0 certainly costs OmniGroup a fair amount of time & money investment, future versions of all their apps will clearly be designed with phones, iPads, and Macs in mind. The code base will surely have more shared code. I'm not saying it will be trivial, but certainly the cost of producing the next version of OmniGraffle for Mac/phone/iPad will be much less than version 1.0 because they will be designing for all 3 at once.
[/quote]
First, I don't think we're ever going to see OmniGraffle for iPhone/iPod with the current screen sizes. Second, based on my observations as an OmniFocus iPhone/iPod beta tester, a large amount of the work done for the release was specific to the iPhone/iPod, and in my opinion it is unlikely to be much different for any other app where the UI on different devices differs to an appreciable degree. OmniFocus on the iPhone is very different from OmniFocus on the Mac. Interacting with a multi-touch tablet device is inherently different than interacting with a mouse and keyboard driven device, and any new features that are reflected in the user interface are going to require substantial amounts of work to bring them to all of the target platforms. It is not inconceivable that the UI work (in aggregate) might be the bulk of the effort for any given feature.
[quote]
But as long as iPads are accessories to your main computer, you need to price the software as an accessory to the main product.

I can't speak for others, but as far as I'm concerned, if it's significantly more expensive than Pages, Keynote, Numbers (or Bento), then I won't buy it.[/QUOTE]
Well, then don't buy it! I prefer a more rational decision-making process: will this tool recover (or otherwise justify) its cost in a reasonable time frame while making my life easier/better? The vendor's reasons for choosing a particular price may have very little to do with your reasons for purchasing the product, and how the cost compares with other applications (particularly other applications that you may not be purchasing) should only matter when trying to decide between two competing choices. For example, Apple has an interest in low prices for those apps in the hopes of selling more hardware, on which they make a healthy profit, but Omni does not.

erikc 2010-03-30 11:59 AM

49 dollars huh
 
I kind of agree with Ken...(wait and see) While i don't want to PAY 50 bucks for another version, I have come to rely on the program to get stuff done.

I am going to wait until the ipad actually comes out and the program actually comes out. If it allows me to take my ipad into meetings and avoid paper and get more things done faster, I'm in!

I think that if we can buy an ipad and if we use omni products, we probably all make enough that 50 bucks can be made up pretty quick in terms of time savings.

If I cant be more efficient with an ipad and the new omni, then i dont really need an ipad either... :)

just my two cents... (or 50 bucks)...

BwanaZulia 2010-03-30 02:20 PM

[QUOTE=Ken Case;75227]Might I suggest reserving judgment until we actually announce a price? At that point we'll also announce what the product is and can do—which is the context you'll need, if you want to judge whether it's worth its price for you.[/QUOTE]

At least you have some good market research...

BZ

Púca 2010-03-30 07:24 PM

[QUOTE=BwanaZulia;75233]At least you have some good market research...

BZ[/QUOTE]

And it was free, to boot. :)

dannythefool 2010-03-30 11:52 PM

[QUOTE=Púca;75221]
But as long as iPads are accessories to your main computer, you need to price the software as an accessory to the main product.
[/QUOTE]

It being an accessory makes no difference. You either need it your don't. The iPad itself costs more than half of the price of a Macbook too.

Púca 2010-04-01 05:50 AM

[QUOTE=dannythefool;75246]It being an accessory makes no difference. You either need it your don't. The iPad itself costs more than half of the price of a Macbook too.[/QUOTE]
True, but the iPad isn't primarily a content [I]creation[/I] device. It's primarily a content [I]consumption[/I] device.

With the iPad in hand, you're sitting on the couch browsing the web while watching TV. Maybe checking e-mail and replying (more so than on the iPhone's tiny screen, but less seriously than, say, while sitting upright at a desk on your MacBook Pro). Playing games, checking YouTube. Starting a modest document in Pages or Numbers.

Will you be writing War & Peace? Creating the ultimate spreadsheet to run your business on? Creating the ultimate flow chart?

Maybe, but probably not.

It'll be lighter uses. Mocking up a 2-page newsletter in Pages; creating a spreadsheet for your kid's baseball team; creating a garden plan in OmniGraffle. That sort of thing.

dannythefool 2010-04-01 06:19 AM

[QUOTE=Púca;75298]True, but the iPad isn't primarily a content [I]creation[/I] device. It's primarily a content [I]consumption[/I] device.
[/QUOTE]

It's what you make of it. If it's a content consumption device for you, you don't need to buy OmniGraffle.

[quote]With the iPad in hand, you're sitting on the couch browsing the web while watching TV.[/quote]

Maybe you are. I got rid of television ten years ago and never looked back.

Looking back in history at computers I've used for work before, the iPad compares very well to devices that are only five years or so older. If I go back ten+ years then the very expensive Pismo Powerbook I used back then probably loses out to an iPad.

What I think Apple is doing with the iPad is trying to "reboot" personal computing. Normal people don't need all the bloat of a full-blown modern personal computer. As far as I can tell, they may well have correctly identified the few key things that people use their computers for.

[quote]It'll be lighter uses. Mocking up a 2-page newsletter in Pages; creating a spreadsheet for your kid's baseball team; creating a garden plan in OmniGraffle. That sort of thing.[/QUOTE]

If you are willing to spend $600 so you can create a garden plan in OmniGraffle, then surely $50 more doesn't make a huge difference because you probably have money coming out of your ears :)

bceaser 2010-04-01 01:01 PM

I also think that $49.99 is too steep, particularly for those of us who already have licenses for the Mac version. There's just no way for me to justify that much extra for functionality I already have on the Mac. One idea: a discounted price or version (or some equivalent depending on app store constraints) for current OmniGraffle licensees.

I also think that a more aggressively priced iPad OmniGraffle app will lead to more OmniGraffle Mac sales.

Púca 2010-04-01 02:10 PM

[QUOTE=bceaser;75313]I also think that a more aggressively priced iPad OmniGraffle app will lead to more OmniGraffle Mac sales.[/QUOTE]
That's my feeling, too: the App Store would give them free advertising. Of course, Omni has the right to charge whatever they want. I was just giving feedback.

BTW, it's on the App Store now. It does look very nice*. It's just not for me (not at $49.99, anyway).


*--It's not clear if you can have custom stencils. Everything I do is with custom stencils, so if it can't do custom stencils, I'm not interested at all, really. But maybe you can e-mail them to yourself and open them on the iPad? I hope they have some sort of solution for that. Omni makes great products.

Richard.Stevens 2010-04-01 08:58 PM

I began my journey with OmniFocus on the iPhone, which led me to their suite of Mac apps. It all began on the mobile for me, and at the time I was very, very skeptical of spending 19.99 on an iPhone app. I think the app was worth 20 bucks. But it would be hard to convince me to spend more than that.

To me, the complete OmniFocus experience cost me $100. Since the Pro version of OmniGraffle is $200, I think they were going for another 1/4th the price of the full version scheme. But OmniGroup sells a version of OmniGraffle for $100, so I might be convinced to buy it for 1/4th that, $25. That would almost feel reasonable to me.

sidlinger 2010-04-01 09:16 PM

My take differs:
1) If you look at how much magazine & newspaper subscriptions for this device cost, and how much TV shows cost, and how much 3G service costs, most things iPad cost a lot. Apple's mainstream apps are cheap but that's anomalous because *everyone* will buy them and also iWork apps drive other Apple revenues (e.g., device sales) whereas Omni has to cover development, marketing, sales and support costs from licensing fees alone. Also, most third-party apps are low-stakes, consumer apps without support, whereas I consider Omni's stuff to be targeted to professionals. iPhone/iPad apps for professionals in specific vertical markets can be *very* expensive. Omni is in the middle: professional-grade but of general interest. And their pricing is about in the middle, perhaps even a bit low.
2) I want Omni's development efforts to be well-funded. I depend on their applications every day and want them to continue to be feature-enhanced, bug-fixed, and well-supported. I use Omni as much as I use Adobe CS4 Master Collection and CS4MC costs $2,499 *for each* of my Mac Pros and Mac Books and $899 (once again, for *each computer* - Adobe won't let you float a seat between systems) every time they roll out an upgrade. I would actually want Omni to charge *more*, across the board, if that would let them go really all-out with feature additions.
3) Nowadays, $50 is, like, lunch. At least in California.
My $0.03

bnz 2010-04-02 01:00 AM

I think it is impossible to discuss the price if we don't know the features. To be honest, if the iPad version really has all the features of the standard Omnigraffle 5 Mac version, but with a touch user interface, then its half the price. While still steep for the App store, this is then a fully fledged App that is worth the price in my opinion.

Having said that, i can't wait to see a video preview of Omnigraffle for the iPad.

Craigc0299 2010-04-02 05:22 AM

My issue I guess is what I will find as an issue across all the iPad apps.
At $49.95 without any way to trial the application is what I worry about, I've wasted so much money on iPhone apps at $5 a pop, doing that at $50 makes me nervous.

The iTunes store reviews are pretty poor and can't really guide purchasing decisions.

If you guys are going to price your apps so high, please at least provide a 'light' version, trial version etc.

Púca 2010-04-02 09:35 AM

The other thing is upgrades. iWork apps for iPad are only $9.99, but Apple charges full prices for new versions of iWork (and iLife). Likewise, there is no upgrade policy (yet?) for iPhone/iPad apps. You have to buy new versions like everyone else. So $9.99 isn't absurdly cheap when you consider you'll pay that every time you upgrade.

So is OmniGraffle for iPad going to be $49.99 next time it gets upgraded? If there's no upgrade discount for iPad apps, how can it be otherwise?

whpalmer4 2010-04-02 10:50 AM

There have been numerous upgrades for OmniFocus for iPhone/iPod touch. Total cost so far: $0.

Brian 2010-04-02 01:00 PM

Just jumping in to say that information on the features of the iPad application, as well as videos of it in action, are available in [URL="http://www.omnigroup.com/products/omnigraffle-ipad"]this new section[/URL] of our website.

Especially when it comes to pricing stuff, I feel like I should defer to Ken, but there are some bits that I can comfortably contribute to the conversation.

We've put a lot of thought into our pricing: we think our iPad apps are a great value, offering the majority of the functionality of our corresponding Mac apps at only half the price.

We are huge fans of "try before you buy". OmniFocus for iPhone is currently installed on Apple Store demo units; we'd like to do the same with these apps if Apple is interested.

We want folks to have plenty of info when they consider a purchase. We will add more over time. Let us know what topics would be helpful in figuring out if the iPad apps will work for you.

The support ninjas are also available via [EMAIL="omnigraffle-ipad@omnigroup.com"]email[/EMAIL] and phone. (800-315-6664 in North America) We'll be working over the launch weekend.

If you feel there's something missing from the iPad apps that would make them more valuable to you at the current price points, we'd love to know that. Adding features to our applications is something we like to do. :-)

We understand that different folks may have different needs. Folks that already have the Mac versions, for example, may look at the apps differently than the folks for whom this is their first purchase.

Brian 2010-04-02 01:33 PM

Macworld has just done an [URL="http://www.macworld.com/article/150283/2010/04/omnigroup_ipad.html?lsrc=rss_main"]article[/URL] that folks may want to read.

Púca 2010-04-02 04:13 PM

[QUOTE=whpalmer4;75348]There have been numerous upgrades for OmniFocus for iPhone/iPod touch. Total cost so far: $0.[/QUOTE]
Omnifocus is at version 1.6.1. To the best of my knowledge, Omni always gives point release updates for free (thank you, Omni!). That's not what I'm talking about.

Brian: interesting review. I'm not sure why you're not separating into Pro and regular versions on the iPad (even though 2/3 of Mac customers buy the Pro version). It would seem you'd be missing out on the large number of casual users who might want to design a garden or a softball team web site or whatever. And in-app purchases would allow them to upgrade easily to a Pro version with layers and whatnot.

Maybe Omni is thinking that iPads will become more corporate than Apple is promoting right now, in which case a higher priced app makes more sense for you guys.

I guess I'll hold out for a Lite version (or some other consumer-oriented product). I'm looking for the equivalent of Photoshop Elements, not Photoshop CS. I'll stick to OmniGraffle on my Mac (which I love, btw). Guess I'm not your typical customer.

whpalmer4 2010-04-02 05:42 PM

[QUOTE=Púca;75371]Omnifocus is at version 1.6.1. To the best of my knowledge, Omni always gives point release updates for free (thank you, Omni!). That's not what I'm talking about.
[/QUOTE]
Then you should be more specific in describing just what it is you are talking about :)

Major releases come with major price tags in Omni-land. Counter-balancing that is the fact that they don't come along very often, and Ken & Co. are pretty good about insisting that they stuff a lot of additional functionality in the apps via the free minor releases. Furthermore, unlike some vendors (I'm looking at you, FileMaker), they've been willing to let you skip releases without having to pay for them. Upgrading from an ancient copy of OmniGraffle 2 bundled with an old laptop to OmniGraffle Pro 5 costs the same as doing so from OmniGraffle 4. Given that OmniGraffle for iPad has only been available for purchase for a day or so, is the first version (indeed, it appears that no one at Omni has even had a chance to run it on an iPad yet!), and Omni has a huge list of projects they want to get out the door over the next year or so, I would be very surprised if we saw a new major version within a year. They've certainly been willing to do plenty of work against the $20 cost of OmniFocus for iPhone. It won't stop being a useful program just because there's a newer major version available. Even if they don't find a way to sell a discounted upgrade to the next major version, if it's going to take you more than a year to get your money's worth out of a software purchase, maybe you don't really need it...

bnz 2010-04-02 11:26 PM

I have no problems shelling out $50 for an OmniGraffle for the iPad, it is probably worth it and alone the fact that is the perfect companion for Keynote on the iPad makes it pretty much a must buy. But i think the person who raised a point about the upgrade pricing is pretty valid. Shelling out again (or better at least) $50 for the OmniGraffle 2.0 for iPad seems pretty steep and Apple doesn't offer anything like App upgrades. This is really the only thing that worries me a little.

By the way: i think a feature matrix comparing the Mac Standard and Pro version with the iPad versions would be pretty helpful. Have you considered to do something like Instaviz? I really love how quick you can get something done with Instaviz.

Púca 2010-04-03 09:07 AM

[QUOTE=whpalmer4;75372]Then you should be more specific in describing just what it is you are talking about :)

Major releases come with major price tags in Omni-land. Counter-balancing that is the fact that they don't come along very often, and Ken & Co. are pretty good about insisting that they stuff a lot of additional functionality in the apps via the free minor releases. Furthermore, unlike some vendors (I'm looking at you, FileMaker), they've been willing to let you skip releases without having to pay for them. Upgrading from an ancient copy of OmniGraffle 2 bundled with an old laptop to OmniGraffle Pro 5 costs the same as doing so from OmniGraffle 4. Given that OmniGraffle for iPad has only been available for purchase for a day or so, is the first version (indeed, it appears that no one at Omni has even had a chance to run it on an iPad yet!), and Omni has a huge list of projects they want to get out the door over the next year or so, I would be very surprised if we saw a new major version within a year. They've certainly been willing to do plenty of work against the $20 cost of OmniFocus for iPhone. It won't stop being a useful program just because there's a newer major version available. Even if they don't find a way to sell a discounted upgrade to the next major version, if it's going to take you more than a year to get your money's worth out of a software purchase, maybe you don't really need it...[/QUOTE]
Well that's just it. I don't need a pro-level app for an iPad--I already have that for my Mac.

I'm just really surprised at the market they're targeting. Omni is 2-3 years ahead of its time: iPads might be all the rage in enterprises in a few years, but right now that is not where they're aimed.

Look at all the video demos on Apple's web site: they're all users sitting casually at a kitchen table or on the couch. They're half lying back. They're all at home.

The iPad is not (currently) aimed at high-productivity office environments. (There's no doubt that it can go there, but that, I believe, is a couple years in the future.)

Coming out with what is essentially OmniGraffle Pro at a high price point, for a hardware product that is clearly aimed at a casual, low-cost, consumer pricepoint is... baffling. :confused:

Maybe Omni has more tricks up their sleeve. I hope they do! :)

BwanaZulia 2010-04-03 04:13 PM

Typing this from my iPad.

Ok, so you guys based it on the Apple model, but that would mean Photoshop for iPad would be $200.

I think you guys got it wrong but will still consider buying it.

BZ

AngelArs 2010-04-03 08:30 PM

[QUOTE=Richard.Stevens;75329] I think the app was worth 20 bucks. But it would be hard to convince me to spend more than that.
[/QUOTE]

Yep, 20 bucks [I]tops[/I], and even that's a bit steep considering that all the other major players are selling their wares for 9.99 and under. Especially in this bad economy... Really disappointed in Omni for over pricing this :(

whpalmer4 2010-04-03 09:31 PM

[QUOTE=AngelArs;75402]Yep, 20 bucks [I]tops[/I], and even that's a bit steep considering that all the other major players are selling their wares for 9.99 and under. Especially in this bad economy... Really disappointed in Omni for over pricing this :([/QUOTE]

But it simply isn't true that everyone is selling for $9.99 and under. Looking at the top 100 grossing iPad apps at the moment, OmniGraffle is #12, with 4 apps above it over the $10 price point, and eyeballing it, about 20% of the top 100 over $10.

The big 3 Apple apps are $9.99 each, but don't forget that Apple a) gets to keep 100% of the price (developers normally get 70%), and b) gets to keep the hefty profits on selling you an iPad so you can run them. A third-party developer would have to charge more to get the same revenue per sale.

If you really think the pricing is wrong, you should not only exercise your right not to purchase the app, but also send email to [email]omnigraffle@omnigroup.com[/email] explaining what you have (not) done and why you think their price is wrong. Then, go find (or write) a different app which meets your needs at a price you are willing to pay.

I confess I've never really understood the mindset where person A produces something and person B feels that they should be able to tell person A what to charge, particularly for sales to person B. If, in your opinion, $10 is a fair price for a program like OmniGraffle for iPad, why aren't you selling a comparable, competing program for that price? It's also a bit over the top to be invoking the economy when speaking of software for a $500+ luxury item.

Joel 2010-04-03 09:35 PM

*ahem* [email]omnigraffle-ipad@omnigroup.com[/email]. But yeah, please do send us your feedback. =)

Púca 2010-04-04 05:20 AM

[QUOTE=whpalmer4;75404]I confess I've never really understood the mindset where person A produces something and person B feels that they should be able to tell person A what to charg[/QUOTE]
I think you're taking this a little too personally. Nobody is telling anyone what to do. We're expressing surprise, disappointment, etc. That's all.

[QUOTE]But it simply isn't true that everyone is selling for $9.99 and under. Looking at the top 100 grossing iPad apps at the moment, OmniGraffle is #12[/QUOTE]
Yes, I noticed that, too. Omni seems to be doing quite well now. If those sales continue after the initial hype calms down a little, well then I guess I was wrong then, wasn't I? :)

Perpetuity 2010-04-04 06:51 AM

Also...
 
And I get dismayed at folk who think they can tell folk what not to tell other folk!


Anyway, Long time user of outlined and graffle. I am surprised at the $50 buck pricing. At 15.00 for a companion to my desktop license I wouldn't blink. Since this would be self financed and not subsidized by my office yet 50 bucks is real steep and I will watch this parade from the sidewalk.

Have promoted Omni since I met you at the MacWorld in Boston! Hope this works out. I also hope to one day have graffle on my iPad but not at this price.

Robert

Typed on my iPad.

Ken Case 2010-04-04 08:23 AM

OmniGraffle for iPad isn't designed as a companion to the Mac app: it's designed as a complete standalone app, with support for multiple canvases, shared layers (only available in the Pro app on Mac), tables (also Pro-only on Mac), smart guides, automatic layout, text formatting, variable substitutions, and so on.

In fact, in some respects OmniGraffle for iPad is a dramatic improvement over the Mac app: the touch interface makes it much easier to create freehand sketches, and if you've ever tried to use OmniGraffle heavily on a MacBook I think you'll agree that the iPad app provides a much better mobile experience. (Given the choice between bringing OmniGraffle for iPad or MacBook to a meeting, I'd choose OmniGraffle for iPad.)

At half the price of the Mac app, OmniGraffle for iPad is already significantly less expensive than its Mac editions—so much less expensive that I worry about the degree to which it might cannibalize our Mac sales.

As [URL="http://www.omnigroup.com/blog/entry/omnigraphsketcher_omnigraffle_for_ipad_now_available/"]we said on our blog[/URL]:

$50 may be too much to spend on entertainment (although many console games cost more), but we don't intend OmniGraffle as a casual purchase: OmniGraffle for iPad is designed as a professional productivity tool, one which will make you more productive and will save you time and money every week.

We feel confident you will be happy with the depth of the feature set, pleasantly surprised by some brand-new options only available on the iPad, and overall find OmniGraffle for iPad to be a good value. As always, we welcome your feedback, so feel free to talk to us about any concerns you have!

davidwb 2010-04-04 08:52 AM

Pig in a Poke
 
I'll accept everything you've said as given but...

you are asking me to spend $50 on a product completely on faith. There's no demo, no lite version. The App store offers no money back guarantee. At $20 I'd cross my fingers and take the risk. Even knowing the quality of Omni products - owning two of them and upgrading them immediately since version 1 - I can't jump this shark.

Ken Case 2010-04-04 10:32 AM

[QUOTE=davidwb;75424]you are asking me to spend $50 on a product completely on faith. There's no demo, no lite version. The App store offers no money back guarantee. At $20 I'd cross my fingers and take the risk. Even knowing the quality of Omni products - owning two of them and upgrading them immediately since version 1 - I can't jump this shark.[/QUOTE]

I think that's perfectly reasonable: you shouldn't spend that sort of money on faith, and we're not asking you to do so.

Building an app worth $50 was simply our first challenge. (And while I think our design, engineering, and QA teams have done a great job so far, we've only reached our first 1.0 milestone: we're not done yet!)

But having built that app, it's now our responsibility to demonstrate to [I]your[/I] satisfaction that it's worth $50 of your money. We've started this process by posting screenshots and intro videos, but we have a lot more work to do on that front: we'll be publishing more videos and other information on our own web site, of course, but it would also help to have trusted third-party reviews, demo copies in retail stores, demo copies available for in-person demonstrations at user groups, and so on.

So, no, please don't cross your fingers and spend your $50 completely on faith. Tell us what you need to be able to make an informed decision, and we'll do our best to help you reach one. (And if your informed decision is not to purchase the app, we'll understand!)

poritsky 2010-04-04 11:26 AM

[QUOTE]So, no, please don't cross your fingers and spend your $50 completely on faith. Tell us what you need to be able to make an informed decision, and we'll do our best to help you reach one. [/QUOTE]

I happen to believe it is worth $50 if you need it (designers, network admins, even filmmakers;-) ). But, it is a good point that not everyone will get "pro" mileage out of the app. One HUGE feature that I think will make the price easier to swallow is one of those "hidden" functions of the desktop OG: Outlining. I didn't see it in the videos you've posted, but my desktop OG workflow is basically: Outline, apply template, then diddle around with my thoughts.

If Omni could shine some light on whether textual outlining is built into the iPad app, or how well it translates when you open the iPad created graffles on your Mac, then I think it really could help explain what the app is for.

On the desktop, OG is so multifunctional one doesn't even know where to begin with explaining what it does. I used it the other day just to do a little Photoshoppery without actually opening that hog of an app. OG isn't (necessarily) mindmapping software, but it's great at that, and it's not outlining software, but it's amazing at that....just like it's not a photoshop replacement, but it's great as that too! When the iPad version makes as much sense as the desktop version functionally (to you, user) then $50 will make sense.

Also, stand strong against the "race to the bottom" omni! This doesn't seem like a widget and it SHOULDN'T be $2.99.

sw001 2010-04-04 02:53 PM

[QUOTE]demo copies in retail stores, demo copies available for in-person demonstrations at user groups, and so on.[/QUOTE]

Why not a demo or limited app in the app store? I know there are other companies that provide limited functionality in a free app as a demo.

blewis 2010-04-05 02:37 AM

[QUOTE=Ken Case;75428]I think that's perfectly reasonable: you shouldn't spend that sort of money on faith, and we're not asking you to do so.

But having built that app, it's now our responsibility to demonstrate to [I]your[/I] satisfaction that it's worth $50 of your money.

Tell us what you need to be able to make an informed decision, and we'll do our best to help you reach one. (And if your informed decision is not to purchase the app, we'll understand!)[/QUOTE]

Ken, this is a pretty classy response. It would be tempting for you to be a smart ass and start rattling off about dev costs and so on. I find it impressive that your response recognizes that the app must speak for itself.

Probably sounds a bit kiss ass, but I thought I'd comment.

Púca 2010-04-05 03:59 AM

Another reason I think Apple iPad apps are so cheap is that Apple wants you to buy a Mac and an iPad.

As companies create expensive software products, I think users will make either/or decisions: either I get a Mac and OG Pro, or I get an iPad and OGPad.

I would think you'd rather have a user who buys OG or OGPro [B]and[/B] a $20 OGLite iPad version ( total income: $120 or $220) rather than just $50 from OG iPad alone.

sw001 2010-04-05 06:43 AM

[QUOTE]OmniGraffle for iPad isn't designed as a companion to the Mac app: it's designed as a complete standalone app, with support for multiple canvases, shared layers (only available in the Pro app on Mac), tables (also Pro-only on Mac), smart guides, automatic layout, text formatting, variable substitutions, and so on.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the replies. One question, after thinking about this, is what happens to tables and other "PRO" features when you import an iPad graffle to the standard (non-Pro) version of the desktop Omingraffle app?

Joel 2010-04-05 10:07 AM

The iPad supports tables and other Pro features like shared layers, etc. Round-tripping between the desktop to the iPad and back again is non-destructive, features that aren't supported on OmniGraffle for iPad won't get lost in that transition.

AngelArs 2010-04-05 10:11 AM

[QUOTE=Perpetuity;75418]Anyway, Long time user of outlined and graffle. I am surprised at the $50 buck pricing. At 15.00 for a companion to my desktop license I wouldn't blink. Since this would be self financed and not subsidized by my office yet 50 bucks is real steep and I will watch this parade from the sidewalk. [/QUOTE]

Yep, [I]the bottom line[/I] is no matter how Omni 'reasons' this steep price, for many people their wallet will NOT open, and no sales will be made. Here's something else to keep in mind, there are other apps, very useful productivity apps, from very well known companies like Dragon NaturallySpeaking, which are FREE! So what the apps does doesn't not always equal its price. It's like they say, "[I]do you want to be happy or do you want to be right[/I]"? They could sell 10 copies at 15.00 and make 150.00, or sell one copy at 49.95 and make one third that amount. The point is that at 49.95 they won't sell as many copies and won't make as much, but if that's what they want, then more power to 'em :p

Ken Case 2010-04-05 10:17 AM

[QUOTE=sw001;75461]Thanks for the replies. One question, after thinking about this, is what happens to tables and other "PRO" features when you import an iPad graffle to the standard (non-Pro) version of the desktop Omingraffle app?[/QUOTE]

OmniGraffle Standard for Mac understands tables and other "pro" features (and can open any document created by OmniGraffle Pro or OmniGraffle for iPad), it just doesn't let you manipulate them.

SWL 2010-04-05 03:23 PM

First, I was also a bit skeptical about the price. Perhaps this is a result of the 'dollar menu' economy we have grown accustom to in the App Store? I digress...

This is serious software folks! It's not a toy. Also comparing Omni's pricing strategy to that of Apple and Adobe is simply flawed. They are a small group with a very niche set of products. Again, I understand that we are taking a leap of faith - however, it's my belief that OmniGroup has a proven track record of quality software and excellent customer care.

If you cannot justify the $50 then you likely do not use this software in a professional manner where the cost could be justified in even a few successful projects. I'm a User Experience Designer...I have my head down in OG 70% of the day. My employer did not fund my iPad nor the purchase of this software, I bought it as a personal investment in my productivity.

Today during a brainstorming session I put it to the test - in a situation where I would normally paper sketch a wireframe. By the end of the hour I had an almost fully fleshed out wireframe and emailed the PDF to the other team members before they got back tot their desks. And later in the day I cleaned it up and added annotations on my desktop.

Sure, it wasn't the easiest - as I am still getting accustomed to the interface and conventions. However - it worked!

I have total faith this software will only get better! I understand it was developed exclusively on a desktop with no knowledge of the hardware constraints nor the usability aspects that can only be truly realized after using them in the intended environment.

Off topic: this is the longest message I have typed yet on the iPad and it too was a pleasure :)

Onward and upward OmniGroup... I cannot wait until the next, more refined update!

Perpetuity 2010-04-06 08:29 AM

Very nice, kudos
 
Just viewed the video tour and wanted to say wow, the app looks amazing. Hopefully I can pick up a license someday.

Púca 2010-04-06 02:37 PM

[QUOTE=SWL;75491]Today during a brainstorming session I put it to the test - in a situation where I would normally paper sketch a wireframe. By the end of the hour I had an almost fully fleshed out wireframe and emailed the PDF to the other team members before they got back tot their desks. And later in the day I cleaned it up and added annotations [B]on my desktop[/B].[/QUOTE]
Right. Exactly.

The 9.5" iPad screen is great for mockups and casual editing. But there's no way I'd give up my 24" monitor attached to my MacBook Pro to edit the final version of a OmniGraffle document.

I can't see the 9.5" screen working with a pro application.

Maybe someday if they make iPad Maxi's. LOL.

dannythefool 2010-04-07 12:04 AM

[QUOTE=Púca;75565]
I can't see the 9.5" screen working with a pro application.
[/QUOTE]

It's a bit of a matter of taste. I'm the counter-example. I used a 12" iBook professionally for a very long time (Small, light, fits between one slightly oversized man and the next seat in a train etc.). The iPad has the same pixel count (1024x768) and similar advantages. Today I use a 13" MacBook whose 1280x800 is not significantly larger.

Púca 2010-04-07 02:03 AM

[QUOTE=dannythefool;75582]It's a bit of a matter of taste. I'm the counter-example. I used a 12" iBook professionally for a very long time (Small, light, fits between one slightly oversized man and the next seat in a train etc.). The iPad has the same pixel count (1024x768) and similar advantages. Today I use a 13" MacBook whose 1280x800 is not significantly larger.[/QUOTE]

Sure, I had a G3 iBook, too. With a 12" screen at 1024x768 and a precise mouse pointer*, you had a lot of accuracy. Even if the iPad were 12", using a finger instead of a mouse pointer, your accuracy is much, much less (trying to select 2 adjacent objects).

But the iPad is only 9.5", so your accuracy is further reduced. So you have to keep the diagram zoomed in quite a bit and work on a small portion at a time.

*--even using a trackpad on an iBook, you have a mouse pointer on the screen, so you know before you click what object will be selected. Using your finger on an iPad, there is no mouse pointer onscreen and it's very hard to distinguish between adjacent objects.

Púca 2010-04-07 06:44 AM

[QUOTE=Joel;75471]The iPad supports tables and other Pro features like shared layers, etc. Round-tripping between the desktop to the iPad and back again is non-destructive, features that aren't supported on OmniGraffle for iPad won't get lost in that transition.[/QUOTE]
Omni certainly did that right. Apple is taking a beating because their iPad apps destroy data when roundtripping advanced features like footnotes.

Brian 2010-04-09 10:46 AM

Seems like folks in this thread may be interested in [URL="http://www.omnigroup.com/blog/entry/30_day_guarantee/"]this blog post[/URL], so I thought I'd mention it. :-)

dude 2010-04-09 07:46 PM

[QUOTE=whpalmer4;75404]I confess I've never really understood the mindset where person A produces something and person B feels that they should be able to tell person A what to charge, particularly for sales to person B. If, in your opinion, $10 is a fair price for a program like OmniGraffle for iPad, why aren't you selling a comparable, competing program for that price? It's also a bit over the top to be invoking the economy when speaking of software for a $500+ luxury item.[/QUOTE]

So everyone should be a mute and not give any feedback to the Omni folks and in turn Omni has no idea what their customer base is feeling? As a business owner myself, that sounds weird to me.

Omni has thick skin and can take the feedback like adults. They'll be fine and I assure you they appreciate the feedback no matter how bad or great.

$50 is steep for me a man with every new Apple gadget and software program going. Maybe an intro price of $25 dollars to get the ball rolling and then move to the $50 once the reviews come in.

Or Omni just stays the course and hope for the best because there is no way Omni charges less now regardless.

dude 2010-04-12 02:25 PM

I bought a copy of graffle for iPad today. $50 is a bit steep but time will tell.

tji 2010-04-24 08:41 AM

I am an owner of OmniGraffle Pro, which I run on my 17" MacBook Pro. I also own an iPad, but have not yet purchased OmniGraffle for it. I'm sure you guys are already aware of my type of issues, but I'll throw in my .02 anyway:

- Since I already have OG Pro on a portable device, the first question is whether it's worth $50 for something I've already got a solution for. If the touch interface is a game changer, the answer is yes. But, I'm not sure that will be the case for me. Some operations will be easy and intuitive, but complex operations or quick operations done via keyboard shortcut on my MBP will only be slower.

- Currently I'm using my iPad as a home and travel device, not a work tool. My employer didn't pay for it and would not reimburse for apps on it. So, it stays at home. I also do work from home, and OG would be useful for personal projects too. But, it's harder to justify expenses for this type of work.

- Currently OG stands out on the periphery of current app pricing. For anyone who really uses it, $50 is a great bargain. But, for anyone not yet convinced they will use it the pricing is enough to give pause.


Another way to go would be to offer some limited versions of OG which are stencil limited to do only do one type of chart.. Flow Charts, Org Charts, Network Diagrams, Floor Plans, etc. If those are in the common app range of ~ $10, then you increase the mass market / impulse buy appeal, and the question for the purchaser changes from "is it worth $50?" to "should I buy the 3 mini-apps I want, or just go for the unlimited version?".

dude 2010-04-24 09:16 AM

So far, the iPad version has not been all that useful. I tend to pull out my notebook and get to it when on the road. I am on the road this week for the week and time will tell the tale for sure.

Dogsbreath 2010-05-19 03:01 PM

I got OmniGraffle with educational discount because of my job. I use it very rarely, but what I turn out always impresses my Visio (on WinPC) using colleagues. When the pricing came out for v5 I sat on my hands and decided to make do with v4.2.2. I just didn't use the app enough to feel that it was worth spending the money on the upgrade.

When I look at my Mac i realise that there is a hell of a lot of software on their that was registered and rarely gets used: ChronoSync, VoodooPad, Fetch, DiskBlaze, Stuffit, Audio Hijack Pro, SoundConvertor, and the list goes on and on.

My iPad will be turning up as soon as Apple release them to us Europeans at the end of this month. I had initially decided to buy OmniGraffle and OmniFocus (when the latter reaches the big screen), but seeing the price of OmniGraffle I just can't justify the purchase. I am just not serious enough of a user to need it that badly.

Omni need to pay their staff to develop and market the app. I can't argue with that, but that doesn't make it easier to justify the cost of the app for me. Now we have a 30 day money back scheme to tempt us with, but somehow I am still not tempted. I would have rather bought it for less and swallowed the bitter pill of it didn't work out for me.

If you can justify it and afford it then go ahead and buy it, however, even as a stand-alone app I can't at this price. I would like it and because of what I do for a living plenty of people get to hear me evangelising about Mac and their products, as well as what others offer in software terms for the Mac platform.. Things must be bad on the PC side as some of the real PC diehards are that I know are coming to our platform.

Ken Case 2010-05-19 08:27 PM

We feel that OmniGraffle for iPad offers incredible value at its $49.99 price: it offers much of the functionality of the $99.95 Mac app (and even some of the functionality of the $199.95 Pro app), but in a much more approachable interface which has been completely redesigned for the iPad and with some of its own exclusive features such as freehand drawing support.

But you don't have to take our word for it: if you read OmniGraffle's App Store reviews, you'll find that its average rating is over 4.5 stars (out of 5.0). You'll also find many happy customers commenting on twitter, such as this quote from earlier this evening:

[INDENT][URL="http://twitter.com/jarrethardie/statuses/14323669264"]@jarrethardie: Omnigraffle for iPad is one of the best applications I've used on any platform. So intuitive. Well done Omni crew! #omnigraffle #ipad[/URL][/INDENT]
And if you live anywhere near an Apple Store, you can try OmniGraffle before you buy it: it's one of the apps on Apple's demo iPads.

OmniGraffle for iPad has only been on sale for a little over six weeks, yet it's already been purchased by over 7,000 customers. Its sales have been steady and strong, placing it consistently near the top of the App Store's top grossing apps (it's currently #10). If you do take the plunge but find that you're unsatisfied with your purchase, as you've noted we offer a 30-day money-back guarantee on all our apps. (Despite this unprecedented offer, less than 0.5% of OmniGraffle's 7,000+ purchasers have asked for their money back.)

That doesn't mean that OmniGraffle is for everyone, certainly: it's intended for people who find it a useful productivity tool and will use it frequently for months and years, not for people who only use it once in a blue moon. But for the people who do get frequent long-term use out of it, at $49.99 it's an incredible bargain.

hypotyposis 2010-05-20 02:43 PM

[QUOTE=Ken Case;77456]We feel that OmniGraffle for iPad offers incredible value at its $49.99 price: it offers much of the functionality of the $99.95 Mac app (and even some of the functionality of the $199.95 Pro app), but in a much more approachable interface which has been completely redesigned for the iPad and with some of its own exclusive features such as freehand drawing support.

But you don't have to take our word for it: if you read OmniGraffle's App Store reviews, you'll find that its average rating is over 4.5 stars (out of 5.0). You'll also find many happy customers commenting on twitter, such as this quote from earlier this evening:

[INDENT][URL="http://twitter.com/jarrethardie/statuses/14323669264"]@jarrethardie: Omnigraffle for iPad is one of the best applications I've used on any platform. So intuitive. Well done Omni crew! #omnigraffle #ipad[/URL][/INDENT]
And if you live anywhere near an Apple Store, you can try OmniGraffle before you buy it: it's one of the apps on Apple's demo iPads.

OmniGraffle for iPad has only been on sale for a little over six weeks, yet it's already been purchased by over 7,000 customers. Its sales have been steady and strong, placing it consistently near the top of the App Store's top grossing apps (it's currently #10). If you do take the plunge but find that you're unsatisfied with your purchase, as you've noted we offer a 30-day money-back guarantee on all our apps. (Despite this unprecedented offer, less than 0.5% of OmniGraffle's 7,000+ purchasers have asked for their money back.)

That doesn't mean that OmniGraffle is for everyone, certainly: it's intended for people who find it a useful productivity tool and will use it frequently for months and years, not for people who only use it once in a blue moon. But for the people who do get frequent long-term use out of it, at $49.99 it's an incredible bargain.[/QUOTE]

Dude, Ken, you hardly need any justification. Maybe if you were a small independent developer it would make sense to attack you on pricing, but obviously you guys know what you are doing (see: sales figures) and I doubt you'd have gone there without any marketing research.
As a very happy user of OG iPad and OmniGraphSketcher iPad, I have absolutely no regret bumping up my student loans to afford your software. I'm guessing that my use of those two apps in the past few months has been atypical: I've just finished my first year of med school, and I've used Omni apps on the iPad as a learning/memory tool. In my particular case (which I realize might not apply to many other users), the ipad interface was a game changer, in combination with Omni apps.
For instance, I "recited" complex graphs for physiology on graph sketcher or neuroanatomy pathways in OG. Being able to draw those pathways or graphs using my hands is radically different from doing it on a computer for my purposes: there's no memorization value in typing things up or drawing them with a mouse, whereas the iPad is as close as you can get to pen and paper. The added value of the omni apps was that they enabled me to render material that is pretty dry and complex in an immediately beautiful format, smoothing curves and drawing perfect shapes from my imperfect traces. While I could have, and indeed did use pen and paper for the same purpose, the superposition of many lines and the difficulty in rendering complex graphs by hand, or in selecting and instantly changing the colour or appearance of an element meant that Omni's iPad apps allowed me to see many connections in the stuff I was drawing that I would have missed out on if doing everything on pen and paper. I'm not going to credit Omni with my passing physio and neuro (sorry guys!), but your apps helped a lot. What's more, I now have beautiful charts in my iPad that I can return to and modify as I go along. That gives me an excuse to recycle mountains of notes :cool:
For certain, there's some features that are still missing (auto-scroll in OG, pretty please? [jk, I already sent in a feature request]). But my now modestly long experience with Omni software (OmniFocus helped a lot with finishing my Ph.D.!), I know for a fact that those developments will come and be solidly implemented at a decent pace.
So, thank you, Omni, from a poor medical student who doesn't regret his $50 (and however much graphsketcher was). Now, of course, if you want to send me OF iPad and OmniPlan iPad for free, that *will* help a lot with my increasingly un-repayable financial debt :D

bnz 2010-05-25 12:04 PM

I still wonder how the 2.0 update will be handled as the App store doesn't support paid updates. I really want to get Omnigraffle and I think it is reasonably priced. In fact, I would buy it instantly despite the fact that I won't be able to get my iPad before end of June. But somehow the thought that an update might cost the same or more again makes my stomache ache a little.

kcwookie 2010-06-01 05:06 AM

2.0 Update
 
[QUOTE=bnz;77628]I still wonder how the 2.0 update will be handled as the App store doesn't support paid updates. I really want to get Omnigraffle and I think it is reasonably priced. In fact, I would buy it instantly despite the fact that I won't be able to get my iPad before end of June. But somehow the thought that an update might cost the same or more again makes my stomache ache a little.[/QUOTE]

I'm not so worried about updates, there is a lot to fix on this version. Once that happens, I'll pay whatever. OG on the iPad works better than on the screen.

bnz 2010-06-01 05:21 AM

Well, its a pity that no support ninja answers. Anyway, I trust that they'll find a fair solution for this. In fact, I couldn't resist and have pre-shopped Omnigraffle for my iPad that I still don't have. Now, if I just could get my hands on a 3G iPad, but it is impossible to get one right now in Germany.

Brian 2010-06-01 02:29 PM

[QUOTE=bnz;77877]Well, its a pity that no support ninja answers.[/QUOTE]

I'm sorry we didn't respond earlier - it's a tough question to answer. Ultimately, I think the only answer we can give you is "we don't know yet".

We really hope Apple improves support for this sort of discounting in the App Store going forward, but we don't know when or if that will happen. In the short term, there are a few more products we have to get out on iPad before we can think about the 2.0 updates...

cybercatfish 2010-07-03 05:17 AM

I also agree. I bought two hours ago.
I like omni product. However, I think that this is expensive.

It is because a necessary function is insufficient.
1. There is no outline function.
 However, only the diagram operates why.
2. When the omni product is bought in Japan, it is always high.
 It sells it for $66 in Japan now.
3. It crashes by a specific operation.
 It is seen frequently in a new product of omni.
4. It makes a mistake in the layered structure because of two or more copy&paste.
 It is seen frequently in a new product of omni.
5. Mac and the file swapping are troublesome.
 The transmission from mac to ipad is done with dropbox.
 However, the opposite direction can use only mailing.

I am using a lot of omni products.
I am enduring it though the charge is a little high.
Therefore, the version must improve early.
I want to come to think it is cheap early.

hypotyposis 2010-07-03 05:22 AM

Hey cybercatfish,

By "It crashes by a specific operation," are you referring to your no.4? If not, what is the "specific operation," and have you reported it directly by email to Omni support? I've always found them extremely responsive to direct contact, and they've been prompt to correct any fatal bugs, in my experience.

[QUOTE=cybercatfish;79643]I also agree. I bought two hours ago.
I like omni product. However, I think that this is expensive.

It is because a necessary function is insufficient.
1. There is no outline function.
 However, only the diagram operates why.
2. When the omni product is bought in Japan, it is always high.
 It sells it for $66 in Japan now.
3. It crashes by a specific operation.
 It is seen frequently in a new product of omni.
4. It makes a mistake in the layered structure because of two or more copy&paste.
 It is seen frequently in a new product of omni.
5. Mac and the file swapping are troublesome.
 The transmission from mac to ipad is done with dropbox.
 However, the opposite direction can use only mailing.

I am using a lot of omni products.
I am enduring it though the charge is a little high.
Therefore, the version must improve early.
I want to come to think it is cheap early.[/QUOTE]

endoftheQ 2010-08-11 03:41 AM

mmmhhh... interesting, I've read this thread through from start to finish, and realised that I'm no longer part of Omni's target market!

I'm fond of the Omni Group and have been a loyal user who holds boxed copies of OmniOutliner and OmniGraffle v.1. I believe that without innovative developers such as Omni the Apple Mac platform would probably not have survived the hinterland years.

I purchased the OmniGraffle for iPad App and have used it a couple of times. It should have been my primary mind-mapping tool, until another App (which cost just a few bucks) came along and blew it away.

OK, OG does a whole lot more than mind-mapping, but so what? I do 99% of any 'professional' diagrams in Microsoft Powerpoint. Why? Because I can send them to clients, colleagues, etc. who can open and edit them, whether they are using either a Mac or a PC.

The other 1%, which need to look truly classy? I do them in Adobe Illustrator, again because it's cross-platform.

I gather OmniOutliner is slated to appear on iDevices. It will need to have serious benefits over another outlining App I've already purchased before I'll put my hand in my wallet again, especially if it's going to be another of Omni's premium-priced offerings.

Oh, and the same goes for OmniFocus. I found a low-priced App (in comparison) that better handles my everyday personal to-do lists, and which more importantly Gets Things Done. In the past week that App has saved me around a couple of hundred dollars, solely because of its share feature.

Can it do fundi-GTD? No! So, do I actually care? No! Not for lists itemising shopping, errands, etc. I'm also now in the process of moving my business GTD to another App, and therefore OmniFocus looks set to be relegated to my third choice out of three.

In the past few days I've emailed two App providers who responded promptly and in detail to my feature requests. I was asking for downloading and Document Interchange from one, who replied he was in the process of incorporating the first into his next release and would add the second into the release after that (admittedly no time schedule, although in the past this App has been updated on an almost monthly basis). The second developer, where I asked to vote on a web interface and an Android port, replied that both would be available within four weeks.

Member's of this Board have been requesting that OmniFocus support tags, contacts, etc. since 2007.

In addition, Mr. Job's statement that developers should "price competitively, go for volume" has created that reality in the App Store, so that Apps over $10 are going to be the exception and that anything above will now, going forward, be perceived as overpriced, if not a complete rip-off, unless they offer compelling features.

The game has changed!

OK, Ken, you asked what might keep users like me within the fold? No, it's not a single, personal must-have feature request. I would respectfully suggest it's an OmniGroup format, as outlined by Marcus Sommer in the Omni Lounge.

If I could interchange the same data between 'Graffle, 'Focus, 'Outliner, 'GraphSketcher across my Mac and iDevices that would be compelling enough for me to stay loyal and feel that your programs at their current price-point were value-for-money, otherwise I'm sorry, but I believe that the product offerings from Omni are rapidly turning into a rather expensive Parade Gone By.... :eek:


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