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OmniFocus needs to pester more Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhm2006 View Post
Then think of it as the difference between a putter and a driver. Both are designed to get the ball in the hole in the same game, but each do it differently.

OF was originally based on Kinkless GTD. I like it being essentially a GTD tool rather than some other kind of productivity tool because I like the principles behind GTD. GTD is not just about getting things done, but about getting things done in a stress-free manner.
Yes, OF is based on Kinkless GTD, but my understanding from folks at Omni, is that they want to make the product that will be help people focus on doing the rights things at right times. Given that, even though the core is based on the GTD concepts, the program can be broader in its implementation. If folks at Omni thinks I'm wrong, let me know, and I'll be corrected, and some folks who want something more and different can seek their solutions at elsewhere.

As far as your analogy is concerned, if you ever played golf, you would never dream of playing the game with just a putter or a driver since you would not be able to perform very well. The golf bag consists of multiple clubs that have their own unique use. In other words, OF can have multiple features that could appeal to some people or not others. As long as these features are non-intrusive, I am more for having more clubs in my bag than just carrying either putter or driver.

Last edited by ksrhee; 2007-10-03 at 06:51 AM..
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ksrhee View Post
As far as your analogy is concerned, if you ever played golf, you would never dream of playing the game with just a putter or a driver since you would not be able to perform very well. The golf bag consists of multiple clubs that have their own unique use. In other words, OF can have multiple features that could appeal to some people or not others. As long as these features are non-intrusive, I am more for having more clubs in my bag than just carrying either putter or driver.
Yes, you are right. I reflected on just that point after I posted, but I wasn't near my computer to correct my analogy. I have played golf and, like golf, productivity requires a bagful of several different tools to make it work well.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhm2006 View Post
Yes, you are right. I reflected on just that point after I posted, but I wasn't near my computer to correct my analogy. I have played golf and, like golf, productivity requires a bagful of several different tools to make it work well.
And, to extend this crazy metaphor even more, those "different tools" are in fact, different: you don't generally use a driver when you should use a putter, nor do you don't see combination putter/drivers.

You choose the right tool for the right situation.

I'm not saying the original goal of more pestering is *bad*, or that OmniFocus should *only* implement canonical GTD (in part because GTD is way to fluid to do that).

Instead, it's important to realize that GTD requires certain features in a software implementation, and other methods of getting things done (lowercase) will require different features, and that at some point, those feature sets might diverge.

Creating applications is tough, as many people on this forum probably know from personal experience. It's particularly tough to please everyone with one application, and developers who do end up with difficult to use applications which no one wants to use.

Focus and simplicity.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by iancjclarke View Post
I would urge you to think about how to make OmniFocus better at nagging the user to perform outstanding tasks, even if OmniFocus isn't necessarily running, or if the user keeps it minimized. Until I can put a task into OmniFocus, and *know* that I will be pestered in a reasonably effective way until I have completed the task, its never going to become my primary repository for outstanding tasks.
Which actions are you wanting OmniFocus to notify you about, and when?

For example, are you wishing OmniFocus would show some sort of count of available actions in the menu bar at all times (near the clock)? Red when some are overdue? Perhaps with a drop-down menu that showed a count of the actions in each of your active contexts, which would take you to that context when selected?

Just some ideas…
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kickaha View Post
Perhaps I've missed it, but the only auto-reminder I actually *do* want, is a review. ie, set actions/projects to be auto-reviewed every Monday by default, and Monday *boom* I get a Review Me sheet that I can just quickly glance at, and if the status quo is good, I can just OK it, or dive in and alter things. Or if a project status needs to be reviewed every month, I can set that, and on the 1st, up that list pops. etc.

As it is, I'm forgetting to review. Maybe I need to add actions for "Review list A", etc. :\
I have a daily review checklist in OmniOutliner. It includes a step to "Review active projects due for review today". I have a perspective saved in OmniFocus for that review. As the OF URL scheme develops, I'll be able to put a URL in my checklist in OmniOutliner. Then a single click will switch OF to the right view.

As to the topic of the thread, there certainly are a variety of notification techniques that would be useful and unobtrusive. For example, I would love to see action count badges on contexts in the sidebar. That's not in-my-face and would be useful information when deciding what context to put myself in.

I think there are perhaps a couple of reasons why some people react strongly to the suggestion that OF include more intrusive reminders. One is a reaction against a perceived violation of GTD orthodoxy, though I think that's likely not the main reason. I suspect the main reason some of us react strongly is that intrusive reminders would be an "attractive nuisance". They might lead us back into bad habits that we've been fighting to get out of. From the point of view, even optional features can seem threatening.
__________________
Cheers,

Curt

Last edited by curt.clifton; 2007-10-03 at 01:50 PM..
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kickaha View Post
Perhaps I've missed it, but the only auto-reminder I actually *do* want, is a review. ie, set actions/projects to be auto-reviewed every Monday by default, and Monday *boom* I get a Review Me sheet that I can just quickly glance at, and if the status quo is good, I can just OK it, or dive in and alter things. Or if a project status needs to be reviewed every month, I can set that, and on the 1st, up that list pops. etc.

As it is, I'm forgetting to review. Maybe I need to add actions for "Review list A", etc. :\
How about creating an iCal repeating entry? I have one of those that pops up every Sunday evening, and since I sync to my iPhone, it pops up there too.

Since you can call an AppleScript from an iCal alarm, you can even have it open a Review perspective for you, e.g. (if you had a perspective named "Review" saved):

Code:
tell application "OmniFocus"
    tell default document
        make new document window with properties {perspective name:"Review"} at end of document windows
    end tell
end tell
(This comes from OmniGroup's release notes a few builds back.)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Case View Post
Which actions are you wanting OmniFocus to notify you about, and when?

For example, are you wishing OmniFocus would show some sort of count of available actions in the menu bar at all times (near the clock)? Red when some are overdue? Perhaps with a drop-down menu that showed a count of the actions in each of your active contexts, which would take you to that context when selected?

Just some ideas…
Thanks. I don't think OF needs to build another nagging feature. Just pass the alarm setting back to iCal, and let iCal trigger the alarm. So, I could set an item in OF to trigger an alarm, but iCal does the triggering. Since iCal alarm typically runs in the background, I think this is a better and/or more elegant solution.

I would like however see a counter badge or numerical symbol next to projects/contexts so that I can see how many actions are assigned to a project or context. This also tells me which project/context does not have any action items assigned as well.

Thanks.
 
Personally I feel that a view based on e.g. due dates would be sufficient, so that content can be reviewd not only on bases of projects or context, but also on due dates. And playing around with the app while reading this thread I indeed find that this is possible using the view bar. I'll keep playing around with this. Hopefully it can function as a kind of 43 folders approach to stuff scheduled for review in the future.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasong View Post
How about creating an iCal repeating entry?

Since you can call an AppleScript from an iCal alarm, you can even have it open a Review perspective for you, e.g. (if you had a perspective named "Review" saved):
Thanks for pointing that out. I am going to try that.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ksrhee View Post
Thanks. I don't think OF needs to build another nagging feature. Just pass the alarm setting back to iCal, and let iCal trigger the alarm. So, I could set an item in OF to trigger an alarm, but iCal does the triggering. Since iCal alarm typically runs in the background, I think this is a better and/or more elegant solution.
This is really all that I think that OF would need to provide for me to be satisfied with it.

The issue for me is all of the things that occasionally need to be done when I actually AM on the go.... With iGTD and other solutions, I would sync my @Errands and @Calls contexts to my phone, and some of these would have reminders flagged on them so as not to allow me to forget about them while I was otherwise occupied. Things like "Pick up milk on the way home" for instance, triggered to fire off an alarm on my phone around the time that I expect to be heading home.

These are things that don't necessarily fit into the GTD Hard Landscape, IMHO, and the last thing I really want is a calendar that is cluttered with trivial events such as these... My calendar is for things that occur at more specific times (ie, meetings), and consume specific amounts of time.

Reminders when I'm in front of my computer are generally less relevant, although I could see the use for these in some cases.

The iCal solution at this point works the best for me, but since OF doesn't actually support setting of alarms within the OF application itself, I end up having to go through a secondary review process of the iCal items following a sync to do something that should have been easily done during my main daily/weekly review process.

On the other hand, my reviews themselves have always been iCal appointments, even when I was using a more paper-based system. In this case I want to actually block out that section of time for my weekly review. I normally expect it to take a half-hour, so I schedule it as such, occasionally moving it around when necessary... By having it in my calendar, however, I ensure that the appropriate amount of time is allocated to actually make it happen. Further, my colleagues (who have limited access to my calendar), see a block of occupied time and do not expect me to be available.
 
 


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