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"we want 4" :) Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Dear Omni Team,
Could we please please please get some hint as to when to expect OO4? :)
 
"When we think it's ready" is the only answer we can really give without running a significant risk of being wrong. :-)
 
Oh ready... means... close, close... OO4 and iPhone app so close that i can´t wait for!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by shinfu View Post
Oh ready... means... close, close... OO4 and iPhone app so close that i can´t wait for!
Though I share your anticipation for version 4, I don't believe Brian's "When we think it's ready" means "close" at all. OG started asking for input on OOP v4 features well over three years ago and the closest I've seen to a commitment from them is "we're considering feature 'X' in version 4".

I'm not trying to be negative - I still hold out hope for OOP, but my group has four major projects due in the next 22 months and we can't use OOP for them because it simply lacks many features that are 'basic' these days. By the time OO4 does see the light of day the new feature set will probably be one generation of 'basic' features behind other apps simply based on the development time. We've moved on and won't have the resources to move back to OOP if/when OOP v4 arrives.

At this rate I'd be happy to see OOP v4 in 2010 but not surprised if it was 2011. An iPhone version is probably looking at 2011 at the earliest. Though OG makes great software it seems that their development cycle moves at a glacial pace. Unfortunately users need to get things done now and we can't wait for OG to finish before we begin.


WSG
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by WrongSizeGlass View Post
I'm not trying to be negative - I still hold out hope for OOP, but my group has four major projects due in the next 22 months and we can't use OOP for them because it simply lacks many features that are 'basic' these days. By the time OO4 does see the light of day the new feature set will probably be one generation of 'basic' features behind other apps simply based on the development time. We've moved on and won't have the resources to move back to OOP if/when OOP v4 arrives.
What does your group want to do with OOP that it cannot? Not knowing what your group does, there are lots of possible answers! Which other apps do you see opening a lead on OOP, and why?

I ask primarily out of curiosity about how others use such general-purpose tools...always interested in hearing about clever ideas!
 
I see that the expression "ready" is not far away of "close". I hope OG will give us a great piece of software, as the always do, but maybe OO4 is the next big step for the after the Snow Leopard update.

Maybe they're waiting to OF get closer in the version to OO and launch OO4 with OF2. But these are speculations.


I think that the OO4 and for the iPhone should be out no so far from middle 2010. I'm working with Outliner (carbonFin) and is great.

OO3 is a great tool and the lack of "basic" features depends of which kind of project are you involved.

Let's see what the OG tell us :-)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by shinfu View Post
Oh ready... means... close, close... OO4 and iPhone app so close that i can´t wait for!
As of July, it was still in the "early stages" :(

http://forums.omnigroup.com/showpost...09&postcount=2

Although there will surely be an update eventually, after so many years, it basically must be treated as a finished product
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by whpalmer4 View Post
What does your group want to do with OOP that it cannot? Not knowing what your group does, there are lots of possible answers!
We do special project and software development for our clients. Before any project can start it must be defined conceptually as well as technically. We start with general descriptions and then add more detail to each group, section, module, feature, etc. We then add more detail to each of those parts. Lather. Rinse. Repeat. All of this lends it self beautifully to a hierarchical approach and OOP does this part well.

The problems arise when we need any type of flexibility within a document. There are many things OOP doesn't do for us in this regard. Here are just a few examples are:
  • Anything like a clone or copy of another section, subsection, sub-subsection, etc, can't be done without copy/paste and there's no way to know how many if any need to be updated when one of them is. Live updating of a shared/common 'part' would solve this.
  • If we need a different column layout for some sections we need to have separate documents. Linking multiple documents within multiple documents isn't a very elegant solution. Multiple column definitions in a single document, even using a tabbed interface, would solve this.
  • Many documents = too many documents. A document format that would function as a simple DB containing OOP documents would solve this. Since an OOP document already serves this purpose for sections/subsections it would basically be an OOP document of OOP documents.
OOP does what it does well - it just doesn't do a lot of what we need.
Quote:
Originally Posted by whpalmer4 View Post
Which other apps do you see opening a lead on OOP, and why?!
I don't know what other apps are out there to compare to OOP. I started using OOP years ago and the process of defining projects with it developed over time.

To meet our document requirements I wrote a web app to manage the process of defining the concepts, details and technical portions. It allows for sections, subsections, etc as 'parts' as well as 'live' links and relationship references to other parts. Many of the properties that would have required multiple documents due to column layouts can be added to headers of each part. We're able to assign dependencies, dates and a variety of other things that help us keep our document organized. The ability to see relationships between items is invaluable.

IMHO OG hasn't integrated OOP, OP & OF well or properly. From where I sit a project starts in OOP where it gets defined and refined. It then needs to move to OP so the project can be managed and treated like a project. OF should really be the 'client' portion of project management where a team member can get their assignments and work through them.

OOP, OP & OF can import/export parts of each other's data to varying degrees but are by no means integrated by any stretch of the imagination. If they each functioned as a separate app for those who needed the specific functionality but served as portions of a suite of apps OG would have an incredible product.

I think OG makes great software. Unfortunately it takes them forever to add features and to bring new versions to market. I don't blame them for not supplying some of the features that I need no mater how basic I think the functionality is. If they can't meet my group's needs we need to move on. However, there's no going back to a product once we've converted all our documents & data to something else whether it's a competitor's product, homegrown or colored index cards with sticky notes on them.


WSG
 
Very reasonable points, no argument here. Let's hope that they've chosen the right collection of new feature to put in OO[P]4, and that they have the resources to get it out in a useful timeframe. Looking at what they've already promised for OP2 and OF2 next year, I think they are going to be busy!
 
 


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