[Rockyroad]

Originally Posted by DerekM

1) Do you need multiple columns of data, column types, or the column summary options?

No.

2) Do you need formatting support? Or just plain text like OmniFocus for the iPhone.

Generally plain text. The basics (bold, italic, underline, colour) would be good (like Shadowplan for Palm)

And do try to give a global option of smaller text sizes so we can see more on the screen. See the iPhone app: Zeptoliner which does this:



(I can't believe how much white screen space and text leading that Apps waste on the iphone [including OmniFocus] compared to apps like Agendus and Shadowplan on the Palm that let you fit heaps of stuff in. Maybe its intrinsic in the iPhone OS and GUI guidelines - beauty reigns over function sometimes at Apple).

3) Do you need attachment support?

No.

4) Should it be a viewer only, or have editing capabilities?

It has to have editing capabilities. This is the problem with the iPhone right now, too much that you can view but can't change. All my Shadowplan outlines on the Palm were regularly added to or modified while "on the road". Come to think of it - I rarely edited them on the computer.

5) What kind of syncing expectations do you have? This would be one big reason why OmniOutliner 4 needs to be developed first as OO3 is not designed for merging synced changes.

MobileMe cloud syncing like OmniFocus would be great.

If you have any other specific expectations for the app, please let us know too. Thanks for your feedback and support!

The current iPhone/iTouch outliner Zeptoliner is probably the one I like the look of right now, but I'd rather have an iPhone Omni that syncs with MobileMe the way that OmniFocus does

Basically if you make it like Shadowplan was/is on the Palm I will write an Oratorio in your honour and perform it at sunrise at Uluru :-)

[Mr. Reeee]

Unfortunately, I still use a Palm for the Brainforest outliner. I'm dying to ditch them both and move over to an iPod touch. I'm not a big phone user and hate AT&T.

I've tried OmniFocus and find it too complex for my uses. Things and Life Balance both offer Mac and iPhone versions that sync both ways.

It seems like OmniOutliner might be a better fit, especially if it had:

FULL editing and creation of files on the iPhone/iPod touch.
Sync BOTH ways between the Mac and iPhone/iPod touch versions!

Formatting isn't a big issue for me, function is!
Attachments? Not necessary.
Some kind of iCal interconnection would be great!

[Ian Wells]

Derek,

You asked: should it be a viewer only, or have editing capabilities? If just a viewer only, how well does the Quick Look preview/DHTML export meet your needs? (Viewing the export on the iPhone that is)

In the first instance that is all I need - I now use OF for task management and OO for a myriad of notes - i.e. anything that needs to be kept and added to later. Some are quite complex and have two or three columns as well as notes. A Quick Look view on the iPhone would be fine, but would need to be coupled with a means of synchronising the files with the originals on my desktop Mac - so how about doing a deal with FileMagnet?!

Also - security might be an issue so can I raise the option to encrypt a whole OO file again?

I hope this helps,

Ian

PS I have been a big OG fan for several years and use you programs at work and home

[haver]

I would like to add my voice to everyone else who would like to see OO for the iPhone. I'm glad to see that there is interest in developping this product. Here are my answers.

Originally Posted by DerekM

1) Do you need multiple columns of data, column types, or the column summary options?

I would like to see multiple columns of data. I often need to make multi column lists so for me, it's very well needed.

2) Do you need formatting support? Or just plain text like OmniFocus for the iPhone.

Formatting is nice, but not a necessity. But, for long list, being able to have some kind of formatting would be very helpful.

3) Do you need attachment support?

Not essential, but would be nice.

4) Should it be a viewer only, or have editing capabilities? If just a viewer only, how well does the Quick Look preview/DHTML export meet your needs? (Viewing the export on the iPhone that is)

Here, I truly believe that editing capabilities is essential. For viewing, we can export the list as HTML and voilà! What is really neat with the iPhone is being able to edit the data on the fly, to be able to add or remove or change some bullet from the list. I don't see any reason to make OO for the iPhone if there is no way to edit the data.

5) What kind of syncing expectations do you have? This would be one big reason why OmniOutliner 4 needs to be developed first as OO3 is not designed for merging synced changes.

This one goes hand in hand with 4). If we can edit the data, we need to be able to sync it back with the original file on our computer.

I hope this all makes sense.

Nelson

OmniOutliner on my iPod touch is the single most important app I've been hoping for! I will mostly use it for categorized checklists. Editing and checking things off are essential, as is syncing to the desktop. I personally would get by without the columns, formatting, and attachments.

My only other concern would be to have a very efficient and flexible browser for my OO files. Sorting alphabetically, by creation date, or by modification date or most-recently-viewed would be useful options. But I might just want to sort them manually, or into a Finder-like folder structure. The bottom line being, finding the outline I need must be as intuitive and effortless as possible, regardless of how many outlines I have.

Thanks to the Omni team for soliciting our input on this!

[Mr. Reeee]

I got my iPod touch today and have been trying to find an immediate solution without resorting to buying OmniFocus. I've been using the free version of OmniOutliner a bit and must say I HATE the convoluted formatting functions, powerful as they may be. Maybe I'll get used to it.

CarbonFin Outliner, for iPhone/iPod touch, allows you to sync OmniOutliner files with their Outliner online. It seems pretty kludgy to me, but it might be worth a look.

http://carbonfin.com/
http://outliner.carbonfin.com/

Originally Posted by DerekM

1) Do you need multiple columns of data, column types, or the column summary options?

Yes. I often use multi columns and column types in OO, and it's really annoying that my current outliner CarbonFin doesn't support it. No need for column summaries.

Originally Posted by DerekM

2) Do you need formatting support? Or just plain text like OmniFocus for the iPhone.

No, I would prefer to have no formatting support! Perhaps colors, but definitly no fonts or font sizes!

Originally Posted by DerekM

3) Do you need attachment support?

Yes, but limited to URLs and Pictures. No need for music and other stuff.

Originally Posted by DerekM

4) Should it be a viewer only, or have editing capabilities? If just a viewer only, how well does the Quick Look preview/DHTML export meet your needs? (Viewing the export on the iPhone that is)

Definitly editable! It's a must!

Originally Posted by DerekM

5) What kind of syncing expectations do you have? This would be one big reason why OmniOutliner 4 needs to be developed first as OO3 is not designed for merging synced changes.

Syncing via iTunes, perhaps also direct in OmniOutliner 4. Syncing via web would be cool, too.
It's very important, that the files are not destroyed, if they contain anything, that is not supported by the iPhone app. E.g. if a file with different fonts will be synced with the mobile OO and synced back to my Mac, it must not loose any information, including fonts, colors, columns, attachments - wether these attributes are shown in the mobile app or not, they have to be back there and not lost!


cu, Micha

[ggirton]

It makes me wonder if there is something wrong with someone's brain. "Do you want the ability to edit your outline on the iPhone?" Helloo_oo! Of course?

The little "Things" app is very nice and (after some growing pains) syncs very nicely, but it is not an outliner. Still, I will keep on using it no matter what, it has the limited date handling that I need built in without the need to go to calendar.

Splashnotes syncs and you can edit, kind of minimal. They have the concept of all of your outlines being in the app. Of course, no one wants to be forced to have all their outlines on the phone. The question is, how to select which ones? Splashnotes does not have the ability to export OPML (or anything else) on the desk, so they deserve to fall into disuse, and when the omni iphone product arrives, probably will. Looking forward to it!

I did not buy CarbonFin simply because the sync-ing process was klugey.

Formatting on the phone is, for my needs, completely unnecessary.

I can't second guess people who use columns; at the moment it isn't something I have explored.

Thanks for the opportunity to share my thoughts on your questions.

[Allen Wicks]

Editing is a necessity. Without editing the app would be useless.

I do not need columns, formatting, attachments, etc. but I do need CLONING very badly (see comments on the cloning thread). Sorry for shouting, but I cannot overstate how much more useful OO would be with the addition of the cloning capability that MORE had.

OO without cloning lacks half its potential utility. Please include cloning in 004 and in the iPhone version.

Note that the easy ability to synch iPhone outlines to the same outline on the desktop/laptop is absolutely essential to an iPhone version of OO. iPhones are great for instant idea input, but have poor ergonomics for major data input; a desktop/iPhone synching outline processor with cloning capability would be a great tool.

[Mr. Reeee]

Originally Posted by ggirton

It makes me wonder if there is something wrong with someone's brain. "Do you want the ability to edit your outline on the iPhone?" Helloo_oo! Of course?

The little "Things" app is very nice and (after some growing pains) syncs very nicely, but it is not an outliner.

I can't second guess people who use columns; at the moment it isn't something I have explored.

Thanks for the opportunity to share my thoughts on your questions.

Editing? No kidding! What's the point if you can't edit on the fly. Without editing, I'd stick with paper lists.

Shockingly, OmniFocus offers extremely limited editing with the iPhone version. I can create or edit the content of an item, but can't move items to where I want them! OF's syncing is kludgy and not very intuitive. It should be a painless setup and direct via Wi-Fi or Bluetooth. For OF's $100 Mac/iPhone entry fee, I expected A LOT MORE!

The Hit List actually found a nice mid-point between Things and OF. Unfortunately, there's no iPhone version and not hint or promise of a definite release date.

Columns would be nice. They'd actually be quite useful. I keep lists with catalogue numbers, dimensions, colors, etc. and they would be a great option.