[Brian]

(This discussion originally started with this post in another thread, but was subsequently split out into a separate topic.)

Originally Posted by Treo

I bought OF for iPad two days ago and have already reported four bugs. One of which is a silly design problem. Create a top level folder, then a project inside it and add some tasks to the project to see what I mean. It's the sort of thing you would have expected someone to try before release.

Really sorry about this! Can you describe what you're seeing in more detail? Here's what I did:

1. Launch OmniFocus
2. Tap "Projects" on the home screen.
3. Tap the plus button in the toolbar, selecting "New Folder" from the popover.
4. Name the new folder, then dismiss the editor panel.
5. Tap and hold on the header for New Folder in the content pane. Select "New Project" from the context menu popover.
6. Name the new project and dismiss the editor.
7. Tap and hold on the new project header. Select "New Action" from the context menu popover.
8. Name the new action, then dismiss the editor.

I tried those steps in both landscape and portrait orientation - I seemed to get the expected results both times, but maybe I missed an important step in triggering the bug you saw? Once I can reproduce it, I'll get it written up ASAP.

[ksrhee]

Originally Posted by Treo

I bought OF for iPad two days ago and have already reported four bugs. One of which is a silly design problem. Create a top level folder, then a project inside it and add some tasks to the project to see what I mean. It's the sort of thing you would have expected someone to try before release. Coupled with problems related to background operation where I have to keep quitting and restarting and I am left disappointed, my disappointment being in direct relation to the price i paid after putting it off for so long. Yes, support are wonderful and always tell you how grateful they are that you wrote to them, but I shouldn't have to be firing off emails twice a day. I've never once reported a bug to Toodledo developers (a cheap app I might add) or Things (another cheaper app) which trumps OF in terms of UI design if not functionality.

The only redeeming feature is the sync, but then I had that with Toodledo so why the hell did I switch? The thing is, perversely, I'll stick it out for a bit because I've paid so much for it. I think Omni have dabbled in the dark arts of pricing psychology. Their Mac apps can't be faulted, but I'm not sure what's happened here.

Please provide more details since I don't see the bugs you mention. I use the iPad version all the time, and it's been stable (hasn't crashed). Obviously it doesn't mean it's completely bug free though.

As far as Toodledo for iPad, I think you are really talking about two different types of programs. However, if you think Toodledo serves your need, more power to you. For me, it didn't even make the first cut it terms of usability and features.

Omni does offer a 30-day money back guarantee if you are not really happy with the purchase.

Ken

[whpalmer4]

My guess is that Treo is surprised the way the indentation of project names and actions is handled inside a folder (actions start at the left margin, regardless of nesting level of project), probably expecting it to be more like OmniFocus on the Mac (indentation monotonically increases with nesting level). Most of the rest of us, upon reflection, see that the way it has been done is superior for a device with limited screen area and don't even consider that some might reflexively think it incorrect.

[Treo]

Originally Posted by whpalmer4

My guess is that Treo is surprised the way the indentation of project names and actions is handled inside a folder (actions start at the left margin, regardless of nesting level of project), probably expecting it to be more like OmniFocus on the Mac (indentation monotonically increases with nesting level). Most of the rest of us, upon reflection, see that the way it has been done is superior for a device with limited screen area and don't even consider that some might reflexively think it incorrect.

Not true. They have acknowledged it is a problem. You have fallen into the trap that because it is so expensive, it must be a deliberate design idea. It's just sloppy.

[Brian]

Originally Posted by Treo

Not true. They have acknowledged it is a problem. You have fallen into the trap that because it is so expensive, it must be a deliberate design idea. It's just sloppy.

Okay, I checked in with some folks here, and it turns out there was some miscommunication on our end. I'm really sorry about this.

This behavior actually is intended as a feature - the thinking behind it is that we should display your tasks similarly to how they would appear in a drawer full of filing folders. The tabs are indented to varying degrees to show the structure, but the content inside those containers utilizes the full width of the larger space they all exist in.

Before anyone draws the wrong conclusion, I took a look at the support response we sent you, Treo, and we did pretty much say "this is a bug and we're going to fix it" in our response. The support ninja meant well, but I think that wasn't the best choice of words, and I think we owe you an apology. (I've discussed this with the ninja in question.)

We do have the request to change the indenting on file, and if other folks feel the same way, we will consider changing it. At the moment, though, we think that there's more to be gained by leaving things as they are. (Folks with long action titles would suffer if we indented the content in each row.)

I suspect there might be some additional discussion of this specific UI point, but we're getting a little bit far afield of the stated topic of the original thread. I'm going to leave your first post in this thread, then break the subsequent discussion into a new one. Wanted to respond in that thead first, though, so notifications would go out about the original thread being updated.

Again, I'm really sorry for the confusion we caused here.

[GeoffAirey]

Originally Posted by Treo

I bought OF for iPad two days ago and have already reported four bugs. One of which is a silly design problem. Create a top level folder, then a project inside it and add some tasks to the project to see what I mean.

I've done it, no problems yet. What are you seeing?

[GeoffAirey]

Originally Posted by Treo

I bought OF for iPad two days ago and have already reported four bugs. One of which is a silly design problem.

Oh and a bug is a fault with an app. a design issue (unless it hinders usage) is usually an annoyance rather than a bug.

[Treo]

Originally Posted by GeoffAirey

Oh and a bug is a fault with an app. a design issue (unless it hinders usage) is usually an annoyance rather than a bug.

Yes, you're right. But At that price you expect UI consistency wouldn't you? I'm just saying....

[whpalmer4]

Originally Posted by Treo

Yes, you're right. But At that price you expect UI consistency wouldn't you? I'm just saying....

At the price charged, I expect the UI design to be tailored for the device on which the software runs. The best UI for a multi-touch touchscreen device (like an iPad) is not likely to be the best UI for a Mac (with or without a multi-touch trackpad) just as the best UI for a device with a small screen (like an iPod touch or iPhone) is not likely to be the best UI for a device with a relatively large screen (iPad). I certainly wouldn't want to be forced to use a crippled UI on my iPad for consistency with a small screen device I didn't own! I can do that for free by running the iPhone app on the iPad. Neither do I want the usability of the iPad to be hindered by needless conformity to the design of the Mac app, which is exactly what would happen if the indentation of nested folders/projects worked the same way, and for what benefit?

[GeoffAirey]

Originally Posted by whpalmer4

At the price charged, I expect the UI design to be tailored for the device on which the software runs. ... I certainly wouldn't want to be forced to use a crippled UI on my iPad for consistency with a small screen device I didn't own!

Whpalmer Johnson (Blazing Saddles) is right

I think it's a massive credit to Omni's developers that rather than just recoding what's on the Mac or iPhone, they've gone back to first principles and tried to make the most of the iPad's screen.

At first, the right justification on tasks jarred a little with me, but I'll be honest I don't even notice it now, what I would notice is if I got to the 4th level of indentations and was getting 15 characters on an action title, and it wouldn't surprise me if some people using it had more levels than myself.

We must also remember that while OF for iPad is an expensive app, it's no beta version. the first version which when released was pretty solid and Omni are listening to see how it was received.

Omni are a rare company which is well run and listens to people and (where it fits their own ideals) will move with what the majority want to provide a better product. Omni listen to customers and provide an excellent level of support, this is what you're paying for in the end. if you buy an app for 20% of the price, are you going to get the same level of customer support? I doubt it.

If you don't like the product, claim your 30 day refund, but don't for a minute think that Omni have just 'missed' this or badly designed the UI, I have no doubt that there was a lot of thought put into it.