[sprugman]

Given that there's a preference, I don't see why setting "soon" to a low number is twisty. I like to be able to see a few days out, so I have it set to 3. If you don't like that, set it lower. (Then again, I also use flags for "today", so clearly I have my head screwed on wrong. ;-)

Snarkiness aside, part of the reason I do things this way is that a) not everything that I have to do has a due date b) I want to be working on things before they're due, not just on the date that they're due. I find the red and orange coloring distinguishing enough to make the list of items in my sorted & grouped by date view scannable.

[rmathes]

absolutely agree on the GTD perspectives, and there are other ways to use the tool to see those things - and I agree they need to be seen.

Re focusing and gee, why can’t I just ignore the other stuff, a couple points:

first, when I go to that view and those tabs are expanded, I don’t want to have to take the time and effort to collapse them so I only see what I want to see. That’s the tool making me adapt to it rather than the tool working as I want.

But if those expand/collapse selections persisted, then perhaps this would not be as onerous. But the behavior I'm seeing is that when I click on another context or go back to project mode, then come back to that view, those selections do not persist and now I have to collapse what I don’t want to see all over again. And again. And again. As long as I stay on that same view, I'm fine. If I leave and return, gotta reset everything. So no, that does not work for me.

don’t make this more than it is. I’m not insisting on ‘purity of function’. I’m not asking for much here. I’m asking that my task management application give me a view that allows me to see what I have due today (and prior), and ONLY those tasks. Just want one view that does that. Just one. Pretty basic stuff, I'd say.

[curt.clifton]

I appreciate the tone of the debate in the recent posts in this thread. There is room for forceful argument here and its great when that can happen without anyone getting upset.

Tim has said elsewhere that items not retaining their collapsed/expanded state is a bug. I'm hopeful that a fix to that will be forthcoming. (My problem is actually a couple of groups that are always collapsed and won't stay expanded, but I feel your pain.)

[rmathes]

fixing this bug will indeed help, but where I'd really like to see this go is to apply the ‘focus’ concept to the context/execution side of things. Brian raises a valid question, why is this important to me. I think the best answer is it’s the fundamental ‘focus’ paradigm that OmniGroup is already embracing. They just aren’t taking it to (in my opinion) full fruition. Why focus? I mean, why not just ignore the other stuff on the screen? Well apparently OG and others see value in visually isolating down to only what you need to interact with and eliminating from view all the rest. I fully agree. Maybe I have a bit of AD&D in me, who knows, but if I see an expandable tab labeled ‘next week’, then mentally a part of me is wondering ‘well gee, I wonder what is in THERE?’

I don’t want to even raise the question in my brain. I just want to see what I want to see and I want to eliminate other data from the view. Focus.

Re sprugman’s point, I don’t want to drive the coming due preference shorter to make this happen because now I lose the coming due functionality. I’d like to be able to set it for 3 days and use it for what it’s name literally implies, see what is perhaps not due today but what will be coming due shortly. Why should I have to give this up in order to twist it into something else that (in my opinion) should be organically available by other means? That’s my point. Like when people say to just use flags. Well if I do that, then I can’t use flags for anything else? And is that truly what flags are designed for?

Basic question: is it reasonable or unreasonable to ask a task management app to provide a view that shows you only what is due today or prior? Obviously I think it’s reasonable. Your mileage may vary.

[Craig]

Originally Posted by rmathes

Maybe I have a bit of AD&D in me, who knows, but if I see an expandable tab labeled ‘next week’, then mentally a part of me is wondering ‘well gee, I wonder what is in THERE?’

Distracting Task attacks and does 2d6 damage!

[sprugman]

Rmathes, I sympathize. I resisted "wasting" flags on Today for a long time, too. The truth is, though, that if I ever want to use them for something else, I can pretty easily uncheck the flags and switch to using them for that. It hasn't really come up. There don't tend to be more than a dozen or so flagged items at a time. (How much can one really get done in a day?)

And is that truly what flags are designed for?

I think it's one reasonable use. OF is flexible enough that there are many potential ways of using it, and finding the one that works best is challenging, and a bit of a moving target, which is why I "waste" time reading this forum. ;-)

I don't disagree that a "due today" view is reasonable, but I've managed to find a way to work that doesn't really need it, and has some features that I like better than I would like that. (If my main working view were "due today", I would be even more encouraged to use artificial due dates than I already am.) I guess you're mileage is varying.

I like the idea of being able to select a bunch of actions and click focus. Even more, I like the idea of being able to manually sort them in context view -- it irks me to have to export to OOP to be able to do that. Especially since Curt's script doesn't take all the data. I doubt we'll get either one of those features by v1, though.

[ksrhee]

Originally Posted by rmathes

fixing this bug will indeed help, but where I'd really like to see this go is to apply the ‘focus’ concept to the context/execution side of things. but if I see an expandable tab labeled ‘next week’, then mentally a part of me is wondering ‘well gee, I wonder what is in THERE?’

I don’t want to even raise the question in my brain. I just want to see what I want to see and I want to eliminate other data from the view. Focus.

Basic question: is it reasonable or unreasonable to ask a task management app to provide a view that shows you only what is due today or prior? Obviously I think it’s reasonable. Your mileage may vary.

I'm not sure whether the question is reasonable or not reasonable, but whether you prefer one way or another. I personally prefer the way OF handles the views since I can see past dues, today, and future dues in one screen. If I don't want to see the others, I can simply collapse the others, and once the expand/collapse bugs are fixed, they will stay put. However, I can see what's coming up in the horizon in this same view, and I will argue that having this flexibility makes OF much more powerful than either iGTD or other program that do not give us this feature.

When I review the tasks in the morning, I can see things I need to do today, but there might be other important things I should be working on today even though they are not "due" today, or perhaps what's due today aren't that important for me than certain future items, or I don't have enough to do's to occupy the whole day as well.

In iGTD or other programs with smart folders, I need to scan three views, past due, today and future (e.g., next 3 days) in order to do the same task that I can do in one view in OF. Of course, I can create a smart folder that allows to show past dues, today's, and future, but then the list gets all mixed up with the list of tasks (that's the reason I created separate views in the first place) and I don't have the ability to "hide" or collapse certain items. Thus, the mixed view does not help me focus.

That's one reason why I love OF so much. It helps me to focus on things that are important to me rather than just urgent . . .

[reuben]

Originally Posted by rmathes

Frankly, in comparing these two apps I'm rooting for OmniFocus. I love the company and their products, and I have more confidence that they’ll be around in 10 years supporting and continuing to develop than I do in one guy in Poland. He gets hit by a bus, iGTD is dead. So there’s intrinsic risk involved in using that app. But right now, at least for me, it lets me get more stuff done with less effort than OmniFocus does. OF is prettier, but sometimes pretty is as pretty does, and for me right now that makes iGTD the belle of the ball.

Actually, iGTD has gone open source hasn't it? There will be a pro version in the future, but the basic app will continue to be donationware.

[reuben]

BTW, reading over on Bartek's blog, it seems that iGTD2 may have taken some inspiration from OmniFocus and could potentially leap far ahead (and at a much lower pricepoint) in the next few weeks. I already paid my $$$ for OF, but if Bartek is serious about everything they are implementing, it's going to be quite slick.

Have a read:
http://bargiel.home.pl/iGTD/blog/index.html

[reuben]

I agree with you wholeheartedly. The program is called OmniFocus after all, ie. all focus. I should be able to focus on all, ie. everything. If I want to focus on today only, the program should provide me that option.

In fact, take a more high level look at one of the selling points of OmniFocus. The ability to let you slice and dice and quickly zoom out to the 20,000 ft. level, but then zoom in to a low level and focus on one specific project.

Shouldn't the same apply to dates, isn't that just the same side of a different coin?