[Helo]

Originally Posted by santra

Actually, my real problem is this: I use the mouse to check off the action, and then have to switch to the keyboard to Cntrl-K to clean up.

Is there a way to check off an Action with the keyboard?

Spacebar, when the entire item is selected. It is the same as in OO, and that is how I guessed at this.

[santra]

Thanks, Helo! Perfect.

[scot]

I like the thingies to vanish when clicked. I don't know if it's supposed to do that, but when i tick a checkbox, all of the completed tasks appear again. That just makes things extra confusing. I just want to check things off and put them out of site & out of mind.

If I check a box by accident, it's easy enough to hit undo. In fact, believe it or not, I accidentally click a box less times per day than I purposefully click a box.

I don't use OF the way a lot of pros here use it. It holds all my projects and tasks, but I use only a very few features and I don't want it to be complicated. I want it to stay out of my way.

[markb]

i hate using Clean Up at all and in fact started looking around for OF alternatives last night since OF seems to be heading in the direction of requiring Clean Up as part of its normal hour-to-hour usage. the last thing i want to do is spend all day Cleaning Up my lists. when i'm done with a task i want to forget about it, not have it sitting there needing another action. for now i am deleting completed items instead of checking them off.

it makes no sense to me that "Clean Up" == "Apply Filter" and that the state of the filter is only accurate if i *haven't* done any work in my lists.

i understand why some people would want to see their completed items but i don't understand why these people want to see them when the filter is set to Remaining or Avaiilable (if i wanted to see checked-off items, i'd expect to have to change the filter to Completed or All).

[brianogilvie]

Originally Posted by markb

i understand why some people would want to see their completed items but i don't understand why these people want to see them when the filter is set to Remaining or Avaiilable (if i wanted to see checked-off items, i'd expect to have to change the filter to Completed or All).

I won't presume to speak for others, but I would like to see the items I have just completed, but not all completed items, until I change the filter. For me there's a big difference between seeing the 657 items I have completed and the 4 items I have completed since I last cleaned up or changed the filter.

[santra]

markb, I feel your pain. I've had the exact same sentiment on many an occasion, and I felt very strongly about this when I started the thread.

I've found, however, that by using "Next" as a filter, the spacebar to complete an action, and Command-K to clean up, I can mostly keep my screen clean, my hands on the keyboard, and my next task the only one visible. I switch to "Available" if I need to see what else is on the program for today, and "Remaining" to see both what's been done today as well as what's in store for the future.

Originally Posted by markb

i hate using Clean Up at all and in fact started looking around for OF alternatives last night since OF seems to be heading in the direction of requiring Clean Up as part of its normal hour-to-hour usage. the last thing i want to do is spend all day Cleaning Up my lists. when i'm done with a task i want to forget about it, not have it sitting there needing another action. for now i am deleting completed items instead of checking them off.

it makes no sense to me that "Clean Up" == "Apply Filter" and that the state of the filter is only accurate if i *haven't* done any work in my lists.

i understand why some people would want to see their completed items but i don't understand why these people want to see them when the filter is set to Remaining or Avaiilable (if i wanted to see checked-off items, i'd expect to have to change the filter to Completed or All).

[markb]

Originally Posted by brianogilvie

I won't presume to speak for others, but I would like to see the items I have just completed, but not all completed items, until I change the filter. For me there's a big difference between seeing the 657 items I have completed and the 4 items I have completed since I last cleaned up or changed the filter.

isn't that what Focus is for?

[markb]

Originally Posted by santra

I've found, however, that by using "Next" as a filter, the spacebar to complete an action, and Command-K to clean up, I can mostly keep my screen clean,

the subtle message with "Clean Up" is that completing a task is somehow making my workspace "dirty". that is exactly opposite of what i want from application like this.

also, never having used kGTD, i really don't understand the love for a generalized Clean Up command in the first place. i know it does several things but i'm not really clear what they are, because the words "Clean Up" don't tell me anything about what it does. if the app needs a "Re-apply Filters" command then that's what it should be called. if it needs a "File Inbox Items" command then that's what *that* should be called. What else does Clean Up do?

[curt.clifton]

Originally Posted by markb

If the app needs a "Re-apply Filters" command then that's what it should be called. if it needs a "File Inbox Items" command then that's what *that* should be called. What else does Clean Up do?

That's pretty much it. And I agree that those should be two separate commands.

I keep clicking the Clean Up toolbar button hoping OF will tidy up my office, but so far that hasn't happened. ;-)

[markb]

Originally Posted by curt.clifton

That's pretty much it. And I agree that those should be two separate commands.

I keep clicking the Clean Up toolbar button hoping OF will tidy up my office, but so far that hasn't happened. ;-)

ya, if they were separate that would probably solve some of the UI difficulties...

"Re-apply Filters" would still make sense if it only applied to the front window (since filters are per-window anyway), whereas changing Clean Up to vary its action depending on what you're looking at would just make it more confusing. that way if i want to remove checked items from the current focus, i could do that without affecting my checked-off items in other projects/contexts (if of course i was the type to leave checked items hanging around).

i can imagine a toolbar icon for Re-apply Filters that would be grayed/unclickable if the window state was currently in-synch with the View filters, and it would light-up if the current view was "dirty". the menu command would behave similarly. this is easy for users to understand since it's the way Save works in document-centric apps. as it stands now now i can click Clean Up all day long without it necessarily doing anything (or maybe it's doing stuff to things i can't see?).

and then a global "Automatically Refilter" preference would make sense too, and wouldn't automatically file inbox items behind your back.