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Why David Allen doesn't "get" GTD Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singleton View Post
but I wish I could figure out how I got to that state in the first place..
it probably is between a iPhone syncing to the desktop....
Judging from the sales numbers, there are thousands and thousands of people doing just that. Perhaps there's a bit more to getting into this state?
Quote:
also, that linking went away, but above I read someone said it is supposed to link to a project of predefined nature? it just defaults to the MAIN screen.
Double-clicking on an item gets you a window focused on the project containing the item you double-clicked. Normally one doesn't double-click on links.
Quote:
but, how do you repeat something you don't know how you got it to do in the first place?
It isn't always easy, and some people are much more adept at puzzling out how to get into (or out of) a weird state. It is serendipitous when such people end up work in customer support!
Quote:
any ideas...about how to properly setup a REPEAT task?

I get confused when it says by DUE DATE or by COMPLETION DATE
You specify a repeat interval, and whether you want the next one to be scheduled based on assigned date or completion date. If you want your next repeat to happen exactly the repeat interval after the first one was due, then you used assigned date. If you want your next repeat to happen exactly the repeat interval after the first one was actually completed, use completion date. As an example of the former, paying your mortgage would most likely use assigned date, because the bank wants the next payment at the right time even if the previous one was late. Getting a haircut would probably be done with completion date. iCal does the "assigned date" option.

Quote:
how can I set up a daily regiment....that I would like to keep as daily...
You want a daily regimen, I think.

Make your daily regimen tasks repeat from assigned date, repeat interval of 1 day, start time 12:00AM, due time 11:59PM.
Quote:
how come this was still made possible on this software?

it should have been thunk out before the release...
It was, and I've got literally thousands of completed repeating actions in my database as evidence that it works. There may be problems with the repeat options, but failure of the user to read the documentation shouldn't be numbered among them.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keone View Post
When it comes to organization systems, task prioritization has been around forever, ceratinly longer than GTD, so a lot of priority fans simply can't shake their old habits. Actually, they don't even want to try.
It's not about habit. It's out of our hands. For many people, bosses, client, or external forces shape priority. While we can try to manage expectations, there is a limit. So yes, I'd love to manage only by context, but in my business it is not realistic 50% of the time.

Now I don't think "priority numbers" are useful. OF does this inherently by physical ranking. But better "heads up" planning views and time-lining would be welcome. We can't always spent our time "heads down" on just the next few tasks.

Last edited by tah; 2009-04-05 at 12:34 PM..
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tah View Post
It's not about habit. It's out of our hands. For many people, bosses, client, or external forces shape priority. While we can try to manage expectations, there is a limit. So yes, I'd love to manage only by context, but in my business it is not realistic 50% of the time.
I disagree. I think a lot of it is habit. We respond the same way we've always responded because it's easier, comfortable. We all have bosses, clients and external forces competing for our time. In spite of that, however, many of us here are quite successful with OF and GTD. Perhaps a more fruitful discussion would be for you to provide us with some typical scenarios that you encounter in your day that you are struggling with in terms of how best to use OF to help you. One question first though: Have you read David Allen's GTD book? If not, you may want to actually do that before posting specific questions to this board.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tah View Post
Now I don't think "priority numbers" are useful. OF does this inherently by physical ranking. But better "heads up" planning views and time-lining would be welcome. We can't always spent our time "heads down" on just the next few tasks.
That's what weekly reviews are all about. They are an important component of the GTD methodology, and if you're not doing them then you're going to get into trouble. OF has some built-in review perspectives that make the process easy. In VIEW>CUSTOMIZE TOOLBAR, drag the following two icons to your toolbar: REVIEW and MARK REVIEWED. Click DONE, and then click on the REVIEW perspective to get a sense of what it does. Post again if you need help with that.
 
whpalmer4, you are certainly a better man than me, Gunga Din! To methodically go through that poster's stream-of-consciousness rants and actually be able to discern what the heck s/he was talking about is certainly a model of Gandhi-like patience. I was about to respond to him/her with "What the heck are you smoking?" But your response was much better, and far more helpful. I salute you!

Last edited by keone; 2009-04-05 at 02:09 PM..
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keone View Post
That's what weekly reviews are all about. They are an important component of the GTD methodology, and if you're not doing them then you're going to get into trouble. OF has some built-in review perspectives that make the process easy. In VIEW>CUSTOMIZE TOOLBAR, drag the following two icons to your toolbar: REVIEW and MARK REVIEWED. Click DONE, and then click on the REVIEW perspective to get a sense of what it does. Post again if you need help with that.
Only OF doesn't have the tools to do the planning or weekly reviews. I have 300 tasks in OF for myself and my 2 employees. The other day I had to spent hours, re-entering all of my OF tasks in Omniplan to realize that we were 6 months out on existing tasks. With OmniFocus, I was guessing (all I can do) that we were 2-3 months out.

There aren't sufficient tools to time planning reviews.
 
Well now boys don't get your panties in a wad....

What I have not been smoking is the sarcasm that comes from such prideful people on this Omniscient list. Ghandi was an idiot. well a peaceful idiot. but he still had a gun under that robe.

Making step by step interactions is only the sign of military mind or priority task master.

Ranting is not what I was doing. Ranting is when you ramble on incoherently with vehement anger.

I love it in email when people get offended by SHOUTING! WHEN IT IS ONLY A WAY OF MAKING A POINT! IT ISN"T REALLY RAISING YOUR VOICE!

It is kind of like putting the wrong enFASSuss on the wrong SIL-OB-UL

but people speak in code speak today, and get all undone....

I must make it very clear that what the dude who was so 'sure' he had figured out what my problem was, really just has not walked a mile in my shoes. If in fact he had sat in this seat, and witnessed what I saw. It was not merely, a DOUBLE CLICKING gesture, to make something go into a more FOCUSED group....have you.

ALL of the ITEMS were LINKS

does this make sense?

There is no DOUBLE CLICKING.
ONLY 'clicking'
or 'clucking'

depending upon what country you are from.

But, still, giving directions without seeing the SCREEN GRAB
is a bit like trying to teach Helen Keller how to do brain surgery.

You may have all the right steps and have memorized the manual but there are still chances of BUGS.

And, this was a bug.

I don't have this happening anymore since I have trashed the preferences.

I would like to send you the file or a video.....so you could have an experience like I did...

But, after the fact you would feel like you were making fun of a crippled person. Because you didn't realize that what I was experiencing is NOT in the MANUAL....

And who ever thought of setting something from 12AM to 1159pm?
that is great idea....

why? such extra hassle? adding dates upon dates?
why tell something you are going to be doing it again tommorrow by giving it such precise numbers....sounds like NASA...ooops they forgot the metric system....or was it inches....or yards...or footcandles....I can't remember.

on iCal...I don't have to THUNK such extra baggage.
only to add the item "MEDITATE LIKE GHANDI"
repeat daily.
when you add this option of based on COMPLETION DATE? or START DATE? or was it DUE DATE? isn't that COMPLETION? whatever...
It shouldn't matter if you are making something DAILY REPEAT.
Give me an example of why you would want to set something in these two different methods of decision, and I will understand the reasoning behind the extra decision making. But, if you ask me to fill in a box checked ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO REPEAT? or just RE-REPEAT? there is a difference.
One creates a FEEDBACK LOOP....
the other, thinks ahead.
=
what was happening was I was getting a REPEAT
You try to check it off
it comes right back!
no check it off!
it comes right back!
and you can't see the date....it is on the iphone...

but if you sync it back to the Desktop....

it plays TENNIS CHECK
One gets checked, as the other one is UNCHECKED...
Now you show me in your manual Harding where it says that syncing will create a feedback loop of inadequate productivity.

but, again, if you were NOT in my shoes...

you would be such an arrogant piece of work of pride
having already READ the MANUAL
and being such a WISE MANUAL READER.
Would have realized, that it doesn't matter what the manual says, if the INTERFACE, reacts a certain way it is BROKEN.

If the ICE MACHINE keeps pouring out ice....onto the floor.

it isn't because the USER failed to READ the MANUAL
Even if there are 1000's of downloads, sounds like bragging....to me!
There are 1000's of GM cars not being bought....but collecting dust too!
it is still a broken ice machine....dumping ice onto the floor.
but we have been doing it this way for 50 years!
The issue seems to be fixed.

But, again, I like to use this forum as it should be used in dealing with the issues at hand.

Details. And Perception.

oooh me smokem peace pipe....make uh bald man with glasses in robe laugh real hard!

Ghandi and Gunga Din don't use OF

I am sure it would be too difficult an apparatus for trying to promote peace or war.....

Speak softly but carry a big sponge.

8-∞

PS- here are the jpg images of the OF screen....I hope this helps share the shoes....and the humor....8-)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tah View Post
Only OF doesn't have the tools to do the planning or weekly reviews. I have 300 tasks in OF for myself and my 2 employees. The other day I had to spent hours, re-entering all of my OF tasks in Omniplan to realize that we were 6 months out on existing tasks. With OmniFocus, I was guessing (all I can do) that we were 2-3 months out.

There aren't sufficient tools to time planning reviews.
Well, then maybe Omniplan is the better app for you, seeing as how you've got to coordinate not only your work but the work of your employees. Omnifocus is a GTD-based task manager designed to help us with our own projects and tasks. Your needs seem to go beyond the scope of that.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keone View Post
Well, then maybe Omniplan is the better app for you, seeing as how you've got to coordinate not only your work but the work of your employees. Omnifocus is a GTD-based task manager designed to help us with our own projects and tasks. Your needs seem to go beyond the scope of that.
A lot of peoples needs are beyond the scope of that. What we need is a small workgroup GTD-ish application. Omnifocus, with some features of Omniplan, and the ability to push tasks to other users.

Omniplan has too much overhead, and doesn't have all the features of omnifocus (quick entry, context, etc, etc). If I enter all my tasks into OF, and they are either sequential or parallel, and have due dates and durations, OF should be able to automatically build a basic gantt chart.

Even if I was working by myself, it is still important to know how much work I have, and when I'd be able to take on more.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singleton View Post
Well now boys don't get your panties in a wad....
My panties are quite fine, thank you. Appreciate your concern though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Singleton View Post
It shouldn't matter if you are making something DAILY REPEAT.
Give me an example of why you would want to set something in these two different methods of decision, and I will understand the reasoning behind the extra decision making.
The difference between REPEAT FROM ASSIGNED DATE and REPEAT FROM COMPLETION DATE is that the first is used when you want a reminder of a hard due date; the second is used when you still want a reminder, but there's some flexibility as to when the task can actually be completed. Here are some examples:

Let's say you create a project entitled "Marjorie's Birthday," which contains a list of tasks such as: think of a present, buy a card, mail the card, etc. Now her birthday is on June 5th and she lives in another city, so you probably need to be finished with all of the tasks associated with her birthday by May 26th, in order to allow enough lead time for the present or card to get to her. Here's how that would look:

PROJECT: Marjorie's Birthday June 5th DUE DATE: 05/26/09
A present or just a card this year? CONTEXT: Thinking
Get a card at the Hallmark store CONTEXT: Errands
Mail card CONTEXT: Errands

But: 1) Marjorie's birthday occurs on the same date every year; and 2) You don't want this project cluttering up your daily view until you actually need to start dealing with it.

So, re: item 1, you select the project, "Marjorie's Birthday" and go to the Inspector window where you check REPEAT EVERY. The number 1 will automatically appear in the blank space, with the MINUTES option preselected. Change that to YEARS. Then beneath that, in the REPEAT FROM field, change the preselected option from COMPLETION DATE to ASSIGNED DATE. Why? Because Marjorie's birthday falls on the same date every year, and you need the same amount of lead time every year as well. In other words, it's a hard date, with no flexibility in when it can be completed.

Now, after you check off each task and then ultimately mark the project as complete, the entire project will pop up again, this time with the date of 05/26/10. (Upon completion, OF automatically bumped the project forward one year from your ASSIGNED due date of 05/26/09.)

Which brings us to item 2: You don't want that project that's not even due again until a year from now cluttering up your view every time you open OF. So when you first create the project, you not only assign a due date to it, but a start date as well. Say, you'd like a one month's lead time each year to prepare for Marjorie's birthday. Here's how it would look:

PROJECT: Marjorie's Birthday June 5th START DATE: 04/26/09 DUE DATE: 05/26/09

Now when you mark the project as completed this year it will disappear from your view until next year on 04/26/10 when you'll need to start working on it again.

The next example deals with the other repeat option: FROM COMPLETION DATE.

You have a Single Action List named "Miscellaneous Tasks" in which you want to create a task to remind you to clean your cat's litter box every week. Here's how that would look:

MISCELLANEOUS TASKS
Clean cat box DUE DATE: 04/07/09
You set your Repeat prefs in the Inspector to REPEAT EVERY 1 WEEK. REPEAT FROM COMPLETION DATE.

Tomorrow morning you open OF, and there it is in red: Clean cat box. But you've been mining for poop in that box every day since you last cleaned it, and it still looks pretty good. Your cat still seems pretty happy with it--he hasn't yet flung any feces at you after all--so it can probably wait another day or two. Now you have two choices in OF: Ignore the red reminder staring at you for the next two days, or if it bothers you that much, you can just go to the due date, make sure it's highlighted and enter 2d. That will push that task forward two days to 04/09/09 so you won't see it in red anymore. Two days later, on 04/09/09, your cat is no longer talking to you and when you open OF, there it is in red again: Clean cat box. So you go ahead and clean it. When you're done, after first making up with your cat of course, you mark the "Clean cat box" task as complete. As soon as you do that, it shows up again in your task list, but this time with the date bumped forward one week (04/16/09) from when you actually completed the task. You open OF one week later, on 4/16/09, and OF displays the reminder to you in red again. This time though, you decide to clean it exactly on that day. You mark the task as complete, and OF again bumps it forward one week. This repeated reminder continues on that way in perpetuity unless you delete the task or change the repeat interval.

Do you see the difference? Again, although you want to be reminded of two different tasks (or projects), one has a hard date attached to it, while the other has a due date that is flexible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Singleton View Post
what was happening was I was getting a REPEAT
You try to check it off
it comes right back!
no check it off!
it comes right back!
Select the task or project, then go into the Inspector and you'll probably see that there is a check mark in front of the REPEAT EVERY pref. Uncheck that and those tasks should stop repeating. If they don't stop, then you need to go to your HELP menu and click on SEND FEEDBACK. Your email manager will open with a new message already addressed to the Omni folks. Just describe your situation as clearly and concisely as you can and send off the message. They will usually reply within 24 hours--that's been my experience at least.

Hope this helps.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tah View Post
A lot of peoples needs are beyond the scope of that. What we need is a small workgroup GTD-ish application. Omnifocus, with some features of Omniplan, and the ability to push tasks to other users.
We're working on integration between OmniPlan and OmniFocus for v2.0 of both products, with a particular focus on the delegation workflow within teams. (Our goal for v1.0 was to get the basic single-user workflow down.)
 
 


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