[thesser]

Along these same lines, either included in a "definitive guide" or as a stand-alone, I would like some kind of guide on how to use the networking symbols included with OmniGraffle. I suppose I can use them any way I want, but if there is any reason that the line types are the shape and color they are, I'd like to follow that.

If anyone knows of any other network flowchart guildelines, I'd appreciate a note or link.

Thank you.

[thesser]

Oh, and I second the opinion that the walkthroughs are rather basic. I would also like to see a set of intermediate tool instructions, or more in-depth examples of how to use the tools and features.

[rekrabm]

I like the discovery process with regard to what OG (and other Omnis) will
do, but that doesn't always work when one is under pressure, as has
probably already been well established on this thread.

I found the combo of walkthroughs and videos of an expert using the omni
apps to be VERY helpful.

My suggestion would be, ordered by suspected effectiveness (most
effective and easiest first):

1) a set of videos of Omni experts accomplishing
various tasks (each person has a different way of thinking, so 2 or more
examples per task) organized as beginning, intermediate & advanced.
The basic videos you already have are very good for beginners to
intermediate level. Record the work of someone putting together
the molecule models or the landscape for the back yard or some of the
other complex samples. Show the experts using the tools, it's
the most telling part of apprenticeship.

2) A set of walkthroughs organized for the 3 levels mentioned above which
walk someone through tool usage and then ask for the user to discover
some slightly more complicated aspect of the task/operation.

3) Some Table of Contents structure that directs the user to the
appropriate video or entry point in the walkthroughs for the task or tool
about which they want to know more.

NOTE: Suggest making the overall structure for for everything
in OO with the videos embedded in the OO document. This would allow
searching of content, easy access to videos, and it would be a great
showcase for OO.

[Bill Van Hecke]

Howdy,

The tutorials in the OmniGraffle PDF-and-print manual do take the approach of working from nothing to a complete document; is this helpful to you at all?

As for videos, I agree that we should make some videocasts available for learning nice tricks about the software. That's on my Kinkless GTD list. :D

[Agnostus]

Originally Posted by wvh

Howdy,

The tutorials in the OmniGraffle PDF-and-print manual do take the approach of working from nothing to a complete document; is this helpful to you at all?

As for videos, I agree that we should make some videocasts available for learning nice tricks about the software. That's on my Kinkless GTD list. :D

Well, it is true that the tutorials in the PDF cover from zero to complete document, BUT, again, along the way, only the basiscs are tought. Though you can create a complete document with just the basics, that still doesn't solve the problem of getting used to the nitty-gritty stuff. Actually, if you have some experience in 2D-drawing apps, most techniques tought in the tutorials are things that seem "standard", i.e. stuff you would do that way intuitively. I want to make my point that what is really lacking is some sort of training to really get finegrained controll over the app, e.g. when it comes to EXACT placement of lines and shapes the way I want and not the way Graffle wants - just to name one example. OmniGraffle - due to his nature as a diagramming versus an drawing app - has a behaviour that is, when it comes to these tasks, quite different from drawing apps. And here the documentation leaves you out in the rain.

[TommyW]

I would echo all of the above (having upgraded to Pro this weekend).

Graffle is your most unique product. A lot of your purchasers would be familiar with drawing programs, what makes OG different, what other things can you do...

[jem]

Actually this is one of my problem with all three Omni programs I own, there are documentation that describes the basics but I miss examples of how to use the more advanced stuff.

[JKT]

Originally Posted by TommyW

I would echo all of the above (having upgraded to Pro this weekend).

Graffle is your most unique product. A lot of your purchasers would be familiar with drawing programs, what makes OG different, what other things can you do...

Well, that one is easy - it isn't a drawing programme ;) It's a diagramming programme.

I suspect that the reason why there isn't a definitive guide for OmniGraffle is because it has changed so much between versions - in terms of those advanced features which people are asking to have documentation for, OmniGraffle 2 is not much like OmniGraffle 3 and OmniGraffle 4 is not much like OmniGraffle 3 (though the differences are less than between 3 and 2). This is a reflection of the lack of "maturity" of the product. I suspect that the next version will be more like OmniGraffle 4 so maybe, preparing the documentation will be easier to do (much like writing the manual for Photoshop with each new upgrade is easy - clone 95% and add that little bit for the few new features).

[marc]

Originally Posted by JKT

I'd actually include them as a part of the download along with the application.

Absolutely agree. The Walkthroughs are only ~400Kb (expanded, ~80Kb compressed), so could easily be bundled within the app, just like the Keyboard shortcuts document in the Help menu, to make them always avaialble (although perhaps in a Sub-menu, it couls start to get a bit crowded in there.)

As for the Sample documents I'd suggest a Help menu link to the Extras page. Granted the Get More Stencils... command also takes you there, but that's an artefact of the Stencils, samples etc. being on the same web page, and not a function of the UI -- later on they may be separated (e.g. if the Stencils system gets an overhaul, and the web page becomes more of a directory/db of Stencils.)

Whishful thinking, perhaps. :)

[graybeal]

As a person under deadline Right Now, and trying to figure out how in the heck a particular feature works, I have to say "amen" to:
1) Bundling all documentation with the app.
2) Documenting all the features *somewhere*

I've been using OG for many years, feverishly only in the last 3 months. I've uncovered maybe 20 things I never found in the documentation, and another 20 I had no idea it could do. (Example: visited the Extras page thanks to the link above, lots of cool stuff there -- then I did the whole walkthrough, which mentioned NONE (? -- close to none?) of the cool stuff. How am I supposed to learn this stuff?

And enough of things don't work (can't find the stamp tool; the brush tool only works if you double-click on it, a single-click ends up being useless) or are badly described (Bezier curves: I don't think "click on 1, drag on 2 and 3" describes what you have to do in normal terms, it's more like "click on 1 and drag to 2, click and drag to 3" that it's easy to give up sometimes. I figured most of them out after 3 tries, but ....

My example of the minute: The stencil that has variables like Date, ModificationDate, etc. in it seems really valuable. But I need to know what formatting codes I can use, and when does the ModificationDate that's displayed really update (in memory and on the screen), and...and...oh heck, gotta get back to work.

Thanks for a wonderfully blissful program, it really is great!!