[steve]

Originally Posted by Toadling

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but the iPhone app *does* allow reordering, even in the inbox. I use it frequently.

I had know I idea this was possible! Great tip, Dennis.

[mr206]

@Justin Oh you've just helped me immensely! I can't believe I didn't think of it before, but the separation between "home" and "home office" makes a lot of sense, even if there isn't a *physical* separation in the locations. That also will help me with syncing OF to Ical via context instead of (as I wish it were) via project. Because "home" can sync to "personal" calendar and "home office" could sync to "work" calendar.

Brilliant! Thanks!

[kidtreo]

I find it takes me about 6 seconds to pull out my iphone and capture in box items. Given the cool audio / picture notes feature of iOF - and the latest feature that allows inbox items to be added before the entire database loads, I have no complaints using it as a trusted capture device. Being able to then sync and organize on my MBP I find a solid and workable system - although truthfully I'm still very much refining how I use this system. My thinking going into this set up was that most of all, I really needed the iPhone app for capture and output - IE, getting items in - and then successfully seeing my lists them when I'm out in the world without my MBP. I think the small form factor of iOF may mean that it's never quite as usable (even if it does get a parody feature set) of desktop OF...again which is fine with me. In and out is all I ask from iOF - leaving serious management to the desktop version. Hopefully as I get better with contexts and perspectives and push those settings to iOF, I'll really get my groove on. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to be able to "manage" my items with iOF as well, but it's not my highest priority. Sorry you feel $4500 was miss spent!

Kidtreo

Originally Posted by defilmj

Thanks Curt, this is helpful. As far as "Going back and reading David Allens book again", I own several worn copies and can nearly recite most sections from memory.

I have been reading the responses, and revisiting his book, and analyzing my prior system. From a purest standpoint, Allen said that he has studied dozens of software systems and none met the need. The fact he has recommended software goes against his 20+ years, but I suspect he has to eat.

Critical to the GTD process is the Inbox. The phone application simply does not replace my pen and 3x5 cards. If the application did much of what the desktop application does (allow re-ordering of tasks, had different methods of presenting the data, and a quick short cut all part of the desktop application, it might make it. Until it has those basic features it can not capture inbox as fast as my cards, and it can not present the data as well as perspectives in the desktop application making the current form of the phone application useless to me at this time. I have faith...

As for the context issue, the struggle here is brain verses computer.
Looking through my cards and folders with project cards in them, and back of cards for when I am at home, etc. I note that I look at the various cards that make up tasks for a project, and the context of the tasks are vast as I am processing the input from these project task cards at brain speed where deviations or augmentation from a specific context is not big deal. When using OF, I am forced to fit it in to one context, when formerly it may have fit in 4-5 contexts that my brain can handle easily without much thought.
Struggling to put it in to a single context, wide, narrow, is not the same as multiple contexts.

Hence this process breaks David Allens royal rule, to those that read the book... Every automated/electronic system he reviewed took more effort to maintain than the manual system he devises and describes in the book.
It is true. I find myself spending more time quickly jotting down thoughts on a IPHONE?? With that keyboard???? NOT! Do it from the keyboard, sure.
THen I have to file them by project, and set their contexts.

This verses, drop it on a black input 3x5 card, 6 seconds to take card and pen out of shirt pocket and begin writing. Then to sort them, I walk through each card that contains projects, and I add the new tasks from my inbox card. The contexts are obvious at brain speed while simply reading them.

I purchased this MBP and Iphone3G plus the broadband adapter and $60/mo plan to run OF on MBP and Iphone, and it turns out once again it can't beat my paper system. Reporting? Yes on the MBP with views and perspectives indeed! But not on the Iphone, as they don't exist.

What I thought was a simple problem with contexts turned out to doom OF for me. I am not a apple fan, so that is $4500 down the drain. :(

[ext555]

What I'm confused about is where did the idea come from that David Allen recommended Omni Focus ? I've been reading his forums/articles etc since 98 when they first appeared . I've never heard him suggest any software .

I can't " quote the book " but I can tell you if I've heard him say it once I've heard it a thousand times " GTD is not about the tools you use " it's a methodology. Of course an iPhone isn't as fast as jotting notes on 3x5 cards but I'm sure glad that I have an item in my OF inbox right now [via the iphone] that my boss warned me not to forget .
For me , this is a big difference to the last time when I found a 3X5 card at the bottom of my computer bag with a similar item 2 days after it was supposed to be handled . Thank God I received mercy that time .

To each their own .

Originally Posted by defilmj

Thanks Curt, this is helpful. As far as "Going back and reading David Allens book again", I own several worn copies and can nearly recite most sections from memory.

I have been reading the responses, and revisiting his book, and analyzing my prior system. From a purest standpoint, Allen said that he has studied dozens of software systems and none met the need. The fact he has recommended software goes against his 20+ years, but I suspect he has to eat.

(

[bbell2000]

I couldn't help but chuckle at the OP's dilemma because I had a horrible time wrapping my head around contexts. What abh19 said about something being too hard to use hit the nail on the head.

I'm not a GTD expert and I haven't read a single Dave Allen book, although I have checked out the website and I've been successfully using OmniFocus at home and work for about 10 months.

Before I understood how to make contexts work for me, I spent more time organizing my tasks than I did executing them. And then the light bulb went on.

I have fewer than 10 contexts that basically define the setting I need to complete the task: Telephone, Internet, Computer, Office, Home, Home Daytime and Out & About.

If I get up one Saturday morning and it's a nice bright sunny day, I look at what I can get done outside -- that's what Home Daytime is for. If I'm running errands, I take the Out & About list with me. If I have 20 minutes between meetings and I'm near a telephone, then I head for the Telephone list.

From my perspective, any other level of categorization belongs in projects and folders.

Originally Posted by defilmj

I am not a (sic) apple fan, so that is $4500 down the drain. :(

Flame bait-- not helpful, and not likely to attract help. But at least your $4500 is helping get America moving again.

[defilmj]

Originally Posted by Toadling

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but the iPhone app *does* allow reordering, even in the inbox. I use it frequently.

It also offers a few different ways of presenting the data, although admittedly not as many as the desktop app. But it's a delicate balance between features, usability, and learning curve.



Anything other than a purely digital system seems awkward and inefficient to me. I'd never go back to pen and paper. But to each his own, I guess.

As for your $4500, there's always eBay. Apple products (particularly MacBook Pros) hold their value quite well.

-Dennis

I have been out of the country and I admit I take for granted that the
whole world runs at broadband speed. Not so! :(

But I am back, and I see lots of responses. I see some took offense
to my Apple bashing. At the time I was frustrated indeed. I will address a
few other posts here instead of stringing a response to each one where appropriate.

I am unaware of a iOF method of re-ordering items within projects.
Can you advise? Or point at where you picked it up from? I am not
afraid to read, and many thanks!!

As for the suggestions of contexts that worked for people, I have adopted some of the suggested contexts, and they are working well for me so far.
I think I took suggestions from each person that made recommendations.
It has made a huge difference. Several were very noteworthy, but "Treating the IOF as a context" in particular is a great idea.

As far as doing most of my entry at the PC. I do. However IOF does not present itself easily for those "Hey Mark, few questions about two projects", and I need instant status. Fumble with the Iphone, people tend to get annoyed. I suspect a perspective would really help there. (Hint...)

Thanks to all those that worked the "Takes too long to sync" issue. The results of your thread was very helpful!

I have my cards still as it is hard to always capture on my Iphone. However
I can often do so now. Why? I can type like a regular keyboard now.
A few weeks of practice and I am humming along. Not as fast as my full keyboard BBerry, but works fine in most situations!

Re David Allen; He never mentioned OF in his book. As another noted he stated that in his 20+ years he has not found a software product that works as well as the suggested GTD method in the book, which is manual. personally I can't use the "folders", as things tend to go in and never come out even if I review them. Works like "Socks in a washer I suppose". 6 pairs go in, 5 pairs plus 1 sock come out??? His point is all the software he reviewed took more effort to use than the benefit gained by using it. True,
until OF IMHO. OF is sooooo close to GTD. I rarely put any due dates on my projects, and I use contexts to see what I can do. I do scan all my projects and stuff to make sure something is not lost, but this is a part of GTD. Also David never said OF is a GTD product, Omnigroup claimed it implements the GTD method well, and I agree. There is no other program I know of, on any other platform I know of, that does as good a job as nailing
GTD down as OF does.

I have run in to an issue that I have not solved yet.... I have a project plan,
(.mpp or a Omniplan), and I need to import it. Because it is difficult to
create a new OF project, and create sub-projects of that project that are
parallel and others sequential. In a given project I may have 10 sequential tasks , and 8 parallel, behind the 8 parallel is additional tasks that are sequential. Etc... Project plans can get complex. Trying to capture that
in OF is real tough. However creating all the parallel, then sequential, grouping them, then ordering them does work. It is a lot of work, and you want to kill yourself if the plan changes, and OF COURSE it always does!!

The suggestions have been helpful. Thank you very much. BTW, for those
using OF that have not read David Allens book, I strongly suggest you do so.
Not only will you find it easy reading and useful, but you will find it very familiar, and he has little lessons in there that can help.

Thanks again and Happy Holidays. Please don't forget the re-order in IOF.

Best Regards,
Mark

[Toadling]

Originally Posted by defilmj

I am unaware of a iOF method of re-ordering items within projects.
Can you advise?

All you have to do is tap on the project to enter it then tap on the Edit button in the upper right corner of the iPhone screen. Each action in the project gets a "handle" with three horizontal stripes on the right side of the row. Drag the handle up or down to move the action to a new position in the project. Tap the Done button in the upper right corner of the screen when you're finished.

Hope this helps!

-Dennis

[whpalmer4]

Originally Posted by defilmj

Re David Allen; He never mentioned OF in his book. As another noted he stated that in his 20+ years he has not found a software product that works as well as the suggested GTD method in the book, which is manual. personally I can't use the "folders", as things tend to go in and never come out even if I review them. Works like "Socks in a washer I suppose". 6 pairs go in, 5 pairs plus 1 sock come out??? His point is all the software he reviewed took more effort to use than the benefit gained by using it. True,
until OF IMHO. OF is sooooo close to GTD. I rarely put any due dates on my projects, and I use contexts to see what I can do. I do scan all my projects and stuff to make sure something is not lost, but this is a part of GTD. Also David never said OF is a GTD product, Omnigroup claimed it implements the GTD method well, and I agree. There is no other program I know of, on any other platform I know of, that does as good a job as nailing
GTD down as OF does.

It's worth noting that The Book is now at least 7 years old, and people haven't stopped writing software just because the date now has a 2 at the front of the year. In particular, one would expect that a popular method would encourage the development of software tailored to it, and such software might fit the author's needs better than previous tools written for a different audience. Besides, who's to say that DA isn't a complete klutz when it comes to operating a computer? I've met plenty of very smart people who have computer skills (even with practice) not a whole lot better than those exhibited in my son's kindergarten computer lab... If operating a computer is a real chore, it stands to reason that a computer-based GTD system is going to have to be pretty fabulous to be worth the effort! I wouldn't get too hung up on that comment of his, as it really doesn't matter how well it works for him, it matters how well it works for you! I'm glad to hear things are working out better with OF for you now...

[Toadling]

Originally Posted by whpalmer4

It's worth noting that The Book is now at least 7 years old, and people haven't stopped writing software just because the date now has a 2 at the front of the year. In particular, one would expect that a popular method would encourage the development of software tailored to it, and such software might fit the author's needs better than previous tools written for a different audience. Besides, who's to say that DA isn't a complete klutz when it comes to operating a computer? I've met plenty of very smart people who have computer skills (even with practice) not a whole lot better than those exhibited in my son's kindergarten computer lab... If operating a computer is a real chore, it stands to reason that a computer-based GTD system is going to have to be pretty fabulous to be worth the effort! I wouldn't get too hung up on that comment of his, as it really doesn't matter how well it works for him, it matters how well it works for you! I'm glad to hear things are working out better with OF for you now...

I was thinking exactly the same thing when I read that passage in the book. Maybe David Allen and I are just from different generations, or different subcultures, but I'd personally never imagine handling my task management with anything other than a computer. It's like the difference between a hand drill and a power drill.

I know lots of people get along fine with old fashioned paper, but I'm a digital guy. Every time I get out a pen and tablet, I keep feeling like I want to save my work and copy and paste. Heck, my handwriting has atrophied so much that my 5-year-old daughter has better penmanship! :-)

-Dennis