[wilsonng]

Well, if anyone wants to volunteer to learn Objective-C, Cocoa, Javascript, and whatever programming language is needed to contribute to OmniFocus, then I'm sure you'll be able to make some contributions to developing software products and adding in your feature requests. Turn in your resumes and hopefully you'll get on board with the Omni engineers.

Yes, I know that many of us use OmniFocus as a cornerstone for our productive lives. But if you've never been on a programming development team, it's not easy.

It might be easier to do one trick pony programs that have a single focus. But to do a task manager program is a monstrous undertaking. Ask Potion Factory (The Hit List) or Cultured Code (Things) and you'll see how difficult it is. Their forums have been swamped with feature requests as much as you'll see in the OmniFocus forums.

If you want to contribute, e-mail the Omni Ninjas with your feature requests and it'll get bumped up the schedule and hopefully see an earlier release. That's what happened with the customizable repeat frequency feature request. It's still a work in progress but at least we're getting something.

However, something like tags certainly sounds like a massive undertaking that will probably require a redesign of the underlying engine and introduces a new world of metaphors and workflows that must be considered.

I've been patient and am willing to hold out for OmniFocus 2. Yes, it can try one's patience but I'm willing to stick it out.

I couldn't wait for Things or Hit List and have found OmniFocus to be a much better tool for me. But we can all scale down if we find Things or Hit List as a suitable alternative.

[endoftheQ]

Originally Posted by wilsonng

However, something like tags certainly sounds like a massive undertaking that will probably require a redesign of the underlying engine and introduces a new world of metaphors and workflows that must be considered.

If OG would fix OF's lamentable inability to search in iOS notes fields, we'd have adequate freeform tagging, right now.

[DrJJWMac]

Originally Posted by endoftheQ

If OG would fix OF's lamentable inability to search in iOS notes fields, we'd have adequate freeform tagging, right now.

In a few days thereafter, this would be noted by everyone interested in "real" options for tagging as being a kludge.

Win one, loose two.

[DrJJWMac]

Originally Posted by endoftheQ

I honestly disagree. If years-and-years go by, and you still find your attachments stuck in an iPhone because OmniFolk can't be bothered to implement basic iOS features, it is futile.

Your personal handwringing laments are duly noted. Again, they do not offer an excuse to justify to the general user of OF that making feature requests to OG is a futile exercise.

Originally Posted by endoftheQ

I've often wondered what PC users do?!

They take their machines apart, put new widgets in them, reassemble them, download the latest patch updates, and hope that fixes the problem :-)

[endoftheQ]

Originally Posted by DrJJWMac

In a few days thereafter, this would be noted by everyone interested in "real" options for tagging as being a kludge.

Win one, loose two.

"Real" options? Sorry, but that's just more OCGTD. I'm happy for anyone wanting fields, predictive tagging and a tag management system. Good luck! However, millions of items get freeform tagged hourly, think Twitter. I'd be grateful for a few more such kludges from OG.

[endoftheQ]

Originally Posted by DrJJWMac

Again, they do not offer an excuse to justify to the general user of OF that making feature requests to OG is a futile exercise.

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
Albert Einstein.

Originally Posted by DrJJWMac

They take their machines apart, put new widgets in them, reassemble them, download the latest patch updates, and hope that fixes the problem :-)

Just like OG, huh?!

[wilsonng]

Originally Posted by endoftheQ

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
Albert Einstein.




Just like OG, huh?!

I'm guessing you've never done any programming? Developing task management software on top of all the other product offerings (OmniGraffle, OmniGraphSketcher, OmniOutliner, OmniPlan, etc is never an easy endeavor. Then there are the respective iOS counterparts in iPad and iPhone) that is also on their plate.

The Omni Folks have been busy. They have been logging in the user feature requests. So I wouldn't accuse them of doing nothing.

Yeah, it's frustrating waiting for it but it'll be worth the wait.

I held my breath and waited a long time for Pixelmator 2 to come out. That felt like forever for me but I'm glad it's finally out.

NovaMind 5 was another program that was in incubation stage for a long time and was released not too long ago. I remember visiting the NovaMind user forums and see threads with the same frustration "when it's coming out? It can't be that hard, is it?"

I remembered going through the Now Software Now X fiasco and finally watching it disintegrate into oblivion.

So I really appreciate the amount of effort and time the OmniFolks have put in to polish up their various software offerings. OmniFocus is in the queue. I think they still have a few more 1.x updates coming while still working on v2.0.

Tagging when wisely implemented may or may not work wonders. Just putting in freeform tagging isn't going to solve everything. I would rather have them get it right by sitting down and thinking about how they would add tagging instead of just throwing something against the wall and hoping it sticks.

Tagging will have repercussions in future versions and must be considered carefully.

OG has consistently stated that they do record the feature requests into their database and pushes the most popular ones up ahead of schedule.

So, if you have lost faith in OG then it might be time to consider other offerings. Good luck.

[endoftheQ]

I have done some programming, although in the spirit of full disclosure, the last language I learnt was probably Cobal, maybe Pascal!

I'm afraid that I've never bought into OG's "we're busy with other apps" excuse, I wouldn't accept a builder telling me I had to wait years for him to complete the roof because he had a lot of other work on, so why is such a lame answer any more acceptable from Omni? The OmniFolk leap about like gerbils on ritalin, so now we're back to the desktop, after they managed to find time for beta-Siri, probably because they want to generate some revenue. I don't think they appreciate that many of us aren't going to buy (in my case, 30-40 licences) a tarted up UI until they go back and fix the underlying mess that is the current OF suite.

Just to be absolutely clear, here are a few examples of what I'm talking about. I can drag a contact to an action on the desktop where it works as expected. However, year-after-year on my iPhone, where said contact would do me the most good, I get John Smith <addressbook://B0DB8EF4-CB3C-4453-89AD-5AFX17BE4399:ABPerson>. Useless. I can email an action and copy-and-paste from my iPad but not from my iPhone. It's pointless adding attachments into the desktop app because without Document Interchange they become hopelessly stuck on iDevices. How about some basic import and export functions? I find even obscure niche apps manage to incorporate OPML. OF? I have to start messing about in OO. etc. etc. ad nauseum.

These are not really 'new feature' requests, they're much more like fixes, and I imagine that as most of them take advantage of core OS functions, they wouldn't require that much effort, unless OF's code is truly filthy. I honestly have no idea how those without desktop OF manage to utilise OF on iOS, I only have to realise that I need to move something before I close OF on my iPad and wait until I'm back at my Mac.

Yes, I'm in favour of field tagging and I think it would be especially helpful to new users. However, one (of two) reasons why our entire team abandoned OF professionally was simply OG's total lack of interest in getting the search function to work in notes fields on iDevices. If this was in place then freeform tagging is already there. You only find out how much of a hinderance OF is (rather than any help) when you suddenly have to review and modify hundreds of actions due to a change of circumstance (in our case a flood in one of the studios we use) and you can't even use the notes field to freeform tag across the suite.

I've long since accepted that on this board any criticism of OG is tantamount to heresy. However, I bought my tickets to the party a long, long time ago, pre-internet, when I had to have their products couriered in boxes from the USA and have continued to buy, in the forlorn hope that OG would at least try and get to grips with this cobbled together half-thought-out half-implemented mish-mash. I'm afraid that I don't look at OG through rose-tinted glasses, if what they're (not) doing is failing me, I'll say so, equally I accept others are fully entitled to applaud that the Emperor is getting some new clothes!

[DrJJWMac]

Originally Posted by endoftheQ

... However, I ... have continued to buy, in the forlorn hope that OG would at least try and get to grips with this cobbled together half-thought-out half-implemented mish-mash. ...!

Sounds to me as though your needs have well outgrown the application. The requests you have are important in that regard. Not all of them are just as important from what OG sees across their entire customer base. Implementing any one request at this point is a balance between further mish-mashing (your words) the existing product to fill a nitch market versus incorporating the feature in to a newer design for a larger audience. To use your analogy ... Should OG cobble together a collection of hand-sized, portable solar panels on a house roof that is soon going to be abandoned (next to the fifty satellite dishes that have been patch-worked in place over the past five years) or should they put a top-notch solar panel array on the roof of the new building currently in development? Does your answer change any when you are told that doing a cobbled-together implementation on the existing house will delay completion of the new house by another six months, and the cobbled-together solar panels only power hand calculators while the solar array powers anything in the entire house?

So ... to continue another of your analogies ... this emperor (OG) has clothes (OF), just not ones that you find particularly attractive or useful anymore. Others here have the same strong desires as you to dress up the emperor a bit nicer. In the meantime, the tailors are busy with the new suit, and it is not at all futile (it is indeed highly appropriate!) to make ongoing requests for its features.

Alternatively, looking for other apps to fulfill your expanded needs may now be the right choice to make, even in the face of what may be coming for OF down the road. All well and good ... just stop blaming someone else (OG in particular) about your growing realizations in this regard please. Based on the ignorances that you correspondingly (and apparently inadvertently) also proclaim in your rants, that is somewhat ... heresy and insanity.

[endoftheQ]

OK, Doc, if you see requests for consistency as further mish-mashing and basic functions such as contacts, search, copy-and-paste, import-export, etc. as niche areas, what can I say, except "enjoy the Kool-Aid"! :)